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K.I.L.E.R
July 2, 2007, 06:59
With my warrior class I use Phase Door (PD), however monsters quickly get to me again. An expensive procedure I use is to PD and and Word of Recall (WoR) right after.

What strategies do you guys use? I tend to play warrior classes.

Fuma
July 2, 2007, 13:13
I play mages, but ?oPD first and after I can afford the scrolls ?oT
After a couple levels, phase door just isn't enough. Especially when running from a group of hounds.

Daven_26d1
July 2, 2007, 14:11
I like to use larger heaps of ?oPD for a fair while, mostly so that I don't end up too far away from quick regenerating uniques when I need a couple turns to swallow !oCCW and maybe re-bless myself. As soon as I'm down to less than 3 castings, I'll usually recall pretty sharpish.

Yeah hounds can be a problem, if I can't detect monsters and I don't have a fair stash of !oSpd or +Spd, then depths below 500' is where I'll switch to teleport, otherwise maybe 800' or so. I'll often carry ?oPD as a throwaway item for tactical purposes - they can come in handy when first breaking into a floor, as teleporting larger distances means more chance of landing in unexpected trouble.

I tend to play the dual-classes (paladins & rangers) but if I played more mages, I think I would lean towards teleport earlier; I usually play the gnome variety, and more than once an unlucky phase has meant my instant demise thanks to my shallow hp base.

@KILER - some other tactics to consider are !oSpd (most effective when you have some corners to dash around, you can heal under cover, then choose to either recall, or pick a good spot for a rematch. Lastly, if you can put monsters to sleep, a trick no angbander should be without when fleeing is to create roadblocks from slumbering monsters.

I don't normally use status wands, but if I find them in the dungeon I hang onto them for usage until I'm about ready to recall and I need the slots for treasure.

Hope some of that helps.

Matthias
July 3, 2007, 00:36
No idea if you need a high device skills in Sang, but in other variants the first teleport for warrior comes in form of a staff. Most variants sell them in town, usually at an affordable price. It is usually the first thing I save money for. You can usually get the needed 4500 after the second or third trip down. And they activate fast enough, even for pure warriors.

HallucinationMushroom
July 3, 2007, 02:38
Stone to mud is a really good wand to have for emergencies. They show up fairly early and have a really low fail rate, from my experience, and are useful throughout the entire game. If you phase door next to a wall melt a zig-zaggy tunnel and get ye to the end of it where you can read a word of recall scroll while reducing the crowd to a series of 1v1 encounters. If the baddies are pack monsters there is a good chance they won't even follow you in. This isn't feasible if you are at the edge of a room filled with monsters or if you can't survive a monster long enough 1v1 with current supplies, but it's a nifty trick. I play mostly warriors as well and I try to always have stone to mud handy. The above advice about the sleeping, hasting, teleporting above is better, but if you find yourself with a wand of stone to mud you can create one heck of a last stand.


When you get late game and teleporting could be deadlier than what you're leaving, *destruction* or teleport level scrolls are effective.

K.I.L.E.R
July 3, 2007, 05:43
I'd just like to ask what all those acronyms stand for and why are there funny characters preceding them?

?oPD
!oCCW
!oSpd

Thanks for the replies.

Matthias
July 3, 2007, 05:51
The first letter represents the type of item. It is the same letter that the ascii mode uses in game
! - Potion
? - Scroll etc

the rest is just short form of the name, in those cases Scroll ofPhaseDoor, Potion ofCureCriticalWounds, Potion ofSpeed. Usually those come even without the o... As in ?PD, !CCW etc

K.I.L.E.R
July 3, 2007, 06:13
Thanks, makes perfect sense now. I'll re-read the thread.

Daven_26d1
July 3, 2007, 14:19
No idea if you need a high device skills in Sang, but in other variants the first teleport for warrior comes in form of a staff. Most variants sell them in town, usually at an affordable price. It is usually the first thing I save money for. You can usually get the needed 4500 after the second or third trip down. And they activate fast enough, even for pure warriors.

In the early to mid stages, I always prefer a stack of scrolls over a staff for a number of reasons:-


Scrolls are cheaper, and thus can be ditched at the end of the dive to carry back more valuable treasure. Just make sure you have a stock in your home, because the shopkeepers don't seem to understand the basic business principles of supply and demand! Staves only work out better value if you are commited to selling or recharging after use.

'Eggs in one basket" - consider:

"It breathes fire! It breathes fire! It breathes fire! -more-
Your staff of teleport is destroyed!"
"It breathes fire! It breatghes fire! It breathes fire! -more-
Some of your scrolls of teleport are destroyed!"
Weight. To mitigate the scenario above, you'd have to carry two @ 10lbs. You can carry 20 scrolls for that amount, and everytime you read one, the weight drops by another 1/2lb.

Activate fast enough?? I prefer instantaneously - the fail chance considerations more than make up for the fact that you can't read scrolls when blind...
Don't get me wrong, later in the game staves become more useful, because *all* of these points can become negligible. Also in something like ToME, devices can yield a much more potent effect than the scroll because of the magic device system itself.

Daven_26d1
July 3, 2007, 14:32
When you get late game and teleporting could be deadlier than what you're leaving, *destruction* or teleport level scrolls are effective.

I would say both of these scrolls are very useful even mid game; though both have a level of unpredictability, and do tend to tie up an inventory slot, as they rarely get read. *destruction* in particular is usually a tad rare to throw away at that stage.

Daniel Fishman
July 4, 2007, 17:43
Though in ToME, which is what he's playing, ?TeleLevel is less useful than it ought to be as it doesn't work in Angband.

XVIITheStar
July 10, 2007, 03:12
I always carry 30~40 charges worth of staves of teleportation + a couple of potions of speed to run away
Matched with a word of recall it should allow to escape most situations

Kav
July 13, 2007, 15:28
I personally like Staves of Teleportation more than scrolls. I find the failure rate acceptable even for wars as I like to teleport early before my hit points get low. There is just no substitute for a teleportation means that can be activated while blind and or confused. I can't tell you how many Umberhulks my _T has saved me from in the early game. And I always prefer to carry more than 2, even if they are expensive early on. But to be honest I usually carry both _T and ?T plus ?PD if I'm a mele. You see I like to have multiple options :p I even carry both !CSW and !CCW even if all that crap does amount to short dungeon trips.

Daven_26d1
July 13, 2007, 15:37
But to be honest I usually carry both _T and ?T plus ?PD if I'm a mele. You see I like to have multiple options :p I even carry both !CSW and !CCW even if all that crap does amount to short dungeon trips.

It doesn't have to amount to short trips - just ditch !CSW, ?PD etc when need the space for treasure. You'll profit more from carrying extra treasure and replacing scrolls and potions than just greedily hanging onto them. Leaving spares in your home might make you feel more comfortable about doing this.

XVIITheStar
July 13, 2007, 16:55
I personally like Staves of Teleportation more than scrolls. I find the failure rate acceptable even for wars as I like to teleport early before my hit points get low. There is just no substitute for a teleportation means that can be activated while blind and or confused. I can't tell you how many Umberhulks my _T has saved me from in the early game. And I always prefer to carry more than 2, even if they are expensive early on. But to be honest I usually carry both _T and ?T plus ?PD if I'm a mele. You see I like to have multiple options :p I even carry both !CSW and !CCW even if all that crap does amount to short dungeon trips.

Same here, _T is my best option (I don't use ?T, uselessly expensive once you own 2 or 3 _T) but I also carry ?PD in case I get surrounded by a few monsters in a small room and !speed and !CCW and !CSW in case I have no more mana (I'm currently playing a life/crusade priest (heng) so I can use the healing spells from life magic)
Potions of speed can save your life in case you are chased by monsters and your recall doesn't seem to want to happen

Daven_26d1
July 14, 2007, 01:06
Potions of speed can save your life in case you are chased by monsters and your recall doesn't seem to want to happen

I usually find that drinking !spd earlier in a battle will give enough of a tactical advantage that I rarely need to teleport or recall at all; At least earlier in the game, anyway. Summoning is the main thing I do teleport away from, but !PD then !Spd can be greatly effective in turning the tables as well.

A good tip in a grinding fight is to try see ahead of time that you will likely start to get into trouble (not always possible, I know!) - a !spd at this point can save you the risk of uncertain teleporting and a heap of potions to boot.