PDA

View Full Version : what to throw away (and other noob questions)


iaindb
January 9, 2008, 05:32
Hi all,

played Angband many years ago for a short while and just rediscovered it :)

I've got my half-elf up to lvl 33, and I'm starting to find the odd ego / magical item. I can't find enough *Identify* for them all!

Anyway, my home is now full, and I just picked up 3 more good items on dungeon level 32-34, so I have to turf something. I've searched this forum for ideas, but this question is always so specific.

I would also point out that I don't know all the ins and outs of the game, so tips on the particular modifiers would be useful. Here's what I've got:


[Character Equipment]

a) a Lucerne Hammer (Holy Avenger) (2d5) (+13,+11) [+4] (+2)
b) a Light Crossbow of Power (x3) (+15,+20) {excellent level}
c) a Tiger Eye Ring of Strength (+5)
d) a Malachite Ring of Dexterity (+4)
e) an Agate Amulet of Infravision (+4)
g) The Leather Scale Mail 'Thalkettoth' (-1) [11,+25] (+3) {DEX+3,spd+3,acid,s}
i) a Small Metal Shield of Resistance [3,+13]
j) The Metal Cap of Thengel [3,+12] (+3) {lucky level}
l) a Pair of Soft Leather Boots of Stealth [2,+5] (+1) {shop}
(plus quite a few rods of light, lightening, frost, etc; nothing else very interesting)

[Character Inventory]

r) Leather Scale Mail of Elvenkind (-1) [11,+11] (+3 to stealth)
It increases your stealth by 3. It provides resistance to acid,
lightning, fire, and cold. It cannot be harmed by the elements. It
might have hidden powers.
s) a Bastard Sword of Extra Attacks (3d4) (+7,+11) (+2)
t) an Awl-Pike (Defender) (1d8) (+5,+9) [+7] (+3 to stealth)
It increases your stealth by 3. It provides resistance to acid,
lightning, fire, and cold. It makes you fall like a feather and
speeds your regeneration. It grants you immunity to paralysis and
the ability to see invisible things. It cannot be harmed by the
elements. It might have hidden powers.
u) a Long Bow of Extra Might (x3) (+10,+11) (+1)

[Home Inventory]

e) Partial Plate Armour (Dwarven) (-3) [22,+4] (+1) {STR,CON,good level}
It increases your strength and constitution by 1. It increases your
infravision by 1. It grants you immunity to paralysis. It cannot
be harmed by acid or fire.
f) an Iron Helm of Telepathy [5,+7] {lucky level}
g) The Set of Gauntlets 'Paurnen' [2,+15]
It cannot be harmed by the elements. It might have hidden powers.
h) The Dagger 'Nimthanc' (2d4) (+4,+6) {superb level}
It cannot be harmed by the elements. It might have hidden powers.
i) a Small Sword of *Slay Evil* (1d6) (+8,+7) (+1) {WIS, regen, level}
j) The Broad Sword 'Arunruth' (3d5) (+20,+12) (+4) {DEX+4}
k) a Broad Sword of Westernesse (2d5) (+10,+12) (+1) {STR,DEX,CON}
It increases your strength, dexterity, and constitution by 1. It
slays orcs, trolls, and giants. It grants you immunity to paralysis
and the ability to see invisible things.
l) The Battle Axe 'Lotharang' (2d8) (+4,+3) (+1) {STR,DEX,orc,troll,cure(level}
m) a Flail of *Slay Animal* (2d6) (+8,+4) (+2) {INT, metab, level}
n) a Pick of Earthquakes (1d3) (+6,+17) (+7)
It increases your strength by 7. It increases your tunneling by 7.
It is branded with acid. It creates earthquakes on impact.
o) a Long Bow of Accuracy (x3) (+17,+13) {good level}

as you can see I've left out various spell books, bolts & arrows, etc. which fill up everything else!

I think I'll sell the Small Sword of *Slay Evil*, and the Flail of *Slay Animal* - they were great when I was low level, but I think I have better.

Is the long bow of extra might better than a crossbow of power, esp cause it's lighter?

Is Thalkettoth better than Evlenkind scale mail, or Dwarven plate armour? I can't find enough *identify* so I don't know what exactly some of these things do.

I had Paurhach and Paurnen, and a whole lotta other stuff, but sold some to buy some stat+ potions. Should I ever keep gauntlets, given I'm a use spells?

Arunruth looks great, but doesn't seem to do as well as the holy avenger. Even Nimthanc was better than many heavier weapons for some reason.

Well, thanks for reading the long post - I have lots of other questions but that'll do for now. I'd appreciate any tips!

cya.

zaimoni
January 9, 2008, 06:06
You also left out your class and stats. That would be helpful. It would not be in bad taste to provide a full dump. [Just wrap it in code tags so the formatting works.]

Power vs. Extra Might: Assuming you are not playing a Ranger, as long as you don't get either disenchanted, Power is going to win (3x20 = 60, 4x11 = 44). I'd take +1 Extra Shots over either, as that halves the time cost of firing.

A 33rd level ranger gets one extra shot when firing a bow (but not a crossbow) from his class. In that case, use the Long Bow of Extra Might (but not for the Extra Might).

Gauntlets: Mages and Rangers should wait for gauntlets that provide one of DEX or Free Action, and sell the others off (if low level).

iaindb
January 9, 2008, 08:02
Hi, thanks for the tips!

You also left out your class and stats. That would be helpful. It would not be in bad taste to provide a full dump.
OK! half elf ranger. the rest is at the end!

Power vs. Extra Might: Assuming you are not playing a Ranger, as long as you don't get either disenchanted, Power is going to win (3x20 = 60, 4x11 = 44). I'd take +1 Extra Shots over either, as that halves the time cost of firing.
so the x3 or x4 is a multiplier over the to-dam value?

A 33rd level ranger gets one extra shot when firing a bow (but not a crossbow) from his class. In that case, use the Long Bow of Extra Might (but not for the Extra Might).cool didn't know that. My bow of accuracy was actually much better, until it got disenchanted; which was when I discovered all about the disenchanter beasts!
Gauntlets: Mages and Rangers should wait for gauntlets that provide one of DEX or Free Action, and sell the others off (if low level).
isn't free action just protection from paralysis? Won't it still affect my spellcasting? Or doesn't it matter at this level with a good enough wisdom, etc.

thanks.


[Angband 3.0.9 Character Dump]

Name Elrond Self RB CB EB Best
Sex Male Age 27 STR: 18/17 +0 +2 +5 18/87
Race Half-Elf Height 59 INT: 18/32 +1 +2 +0 18/62
Class Ranger Weight 132 WIS: 17 -1 +0 +5 18/30
Title Explorer Status 11 DEX: 16 +1 +1 +7 18/70
HP 315/315 Maximize Y CON: 18 -1 +1 +0 18
SP 70/70 CHR: 18/60 +1 +1 +3 18/110

Level 33 Armor [20,+63] Saving Throw Superb
Cur Exp 333545 Fight (+6,+5) Stealth Very Good
Max Exp 333545 Melee (+19,+16) Fighting Superb
Adv Exp 385000 Shoot (+21,+20) Shooting Legendary
MaxDepth Lev 32 Blows 3/turn Disarming Excellent
Turns 5574307 Shots 1/turn Magic Device Superb
Gold 45097 Infra 60 ft Perception Fair
Burden 210.5 lbs Speed 1 Searching Good

Your mother was of the Avari. You are one of several children of a
Serf. You are a well liked child. You have brown eyes, straight
auburn hair, and an average complexion.


abcdefghijkl@ abcdefghijkl@
Acid:......+.+.... Blind:.............
Elec:........+.... Confu:.........+...
Fire:........+.... Sound:.............
Cold:........+.... Shard:......+......
Pois:............. Nexus:.............
Fear:+............ Nethr:.............
Lite:............. Chaos:.............
Dark:............. Disen:.............

abcdefghijkl@ abcdefghijkl@
S.Dig:............. Stea.:...........+.
Feath:............. Sear.:.............
PLite:.....+....... Infra:....+........
Regen:............. Tunn.:.............
Telep:............. Speed:......+......
Invis:+............ Blows:.............
FrAct:............. Shots:.............
HLife:............. Might:.............


[Character Equipment]

a) a Lucerne Hammer (Holy Avenger) (2d5) (+13,+11) [+4] (+2) {WIS+2,fear,invis}
It increases your wisdom by 2. It slays demons, undead, and all
evil creatures. It provides resistance to fear. It is blessed by
the gods. It grants you the ability to see invisible things. It
might have hidden powers.
b) a Light Crossbow of Power (x3) (+15,+20) {excellent level}
c) a Tiger Eye Ring of Strength (+5)
It increases your strength by 5. It sustains your strength.
d) a Malachite Ring of Dexterity (+4)
It increases your dexterity by 4. It sustains your dexterity.
e) an Agate Amulet of Infravision (+4)
It increases your infravision by 4.
f) a Lantern of Brightness (7326 turns)
It usually provides light of radius 3. It cannot be harmed by fire.

g) The Leather Scale Mail 'Thalkettoth' (-1) [11,+25] (+3) {DEX+3,spd+3,acid,s}
It increases your dexterity by 3. It increases your speed by 3. It
provides resistance to acid and shards. It cannot be harmed by the
elements.
h) a Cloak [1,+1]
i) a Small Metal Shield of Resistance [3,+13]
It provides resistance to acid, lightning, fire, and cold. It
cannot be harmed by the elements.
j) The Metal Cap of Thengel [3,+12] (+3) {lucky level}
It increases your wisdom and charisma by 3. It provides resistance
to confusion. It cannot be harmed by the elements.
k) (nothing)
l) a Pair of Soft Leather Boots of Stealth [2,+5] (+1) {shop}
It increases your stealth by 1.


[Character Inventory]

a) 3 Books of Magic Spells [Magic for Beginners]
b) 3 Books of Magic Spells [Conjurings and Tricks]
c) 3 Books of Magic Spells [Incantations and Illusions]
d) 2 Books of Magic Spells [Sorcery and Evocations]
e) a Book of Magic Spells [Resistances of Scarabtarices]
It cannot be harmed by the elements.
f) a Book of Magic Spells [Raal's Tome of Destruction]
It cannot be harmed by the elements.
g) 10 Flasks of oil
h) a Puce Potion of Heroism
i) 6 Grey Speckled Potions of Cure Critical Wounds
j) 2 Red Speckled Potions of Healing
k) 9 Scrolls titled "leta oporigo" of Word of Recall
l) 8 Cast Iron Rods of Light
m) 7 Tin-Plated Rods of Lightning Bolts
n) a Nickel Rod of Frost Bolts
o) a Silver Wand of Drain Life (5 charges)
p) a Silver-Plated Wand of Acid Bolts (9 charges)
q) an Ashen Staff of Teleportation
r) Leather Scale Mail of Elvenkind (-1) [11,+11] (+3 to stealth)
It increases your stealth by 3. It provides resistance to acid,
lightning, fire, and cold. It cannot be harmed by the elements. It
might have hidden powers.
s) a Bastard Sword of Extra Attacks (3d4) (+7,+11) (+2)
It increases your attack speed by 2.
t) an Awl-Pike (Defender) (1d8) (+5,+9) [+7] (+3 to stealth)
It increases your stealth by 3. It provides resistance to acid,
lightning, fire, and cold. It makes you fall like a feather and
speeds your regeneration. It grants you immunity to paralysis and
the ability to see invisible things. It cannot be harmed by the
elements. It might have hidden powers.
u) a Long Bow of Extra Might (x3) (+10,+11) (+1)
It increases your shooting power by 1.
v) 24 Bolts of Acid (1d5) (+6,+7)
It is branded with acid. It cannot be harmed by acid.
w) 70 Bolts (1d5) (+0,+0)


[Home Inventory]

a) 4 Books of Magic Spells [Magic for Beginners]
b) 3 Books of Magic Spells [Conjurings and Tricks]
c) 5 Books of Magic Spells [Incantations and Illusions]
d) a Flint Stone Amulet of Charisma (+2)
It increases your charisma by 2. It sustains your charisma.
e) Partial Plate Armour (Dwarven) (-3) [22,+4] (+1) {good level}
It increases your strength and constitution by 1. It increases your
infravision by 1. It grants you immunity to paralysis. It cannot
be harmed by acid or fire.
f) an Iron Helm of Telepathy [5,+7] {lucky level}
It grants you the power of telepathy.
g) The Set of Gauntlets 'Paurnen' [2,+15]
It cannot be harmed by the elements. It might have hidden powers.
h) The Dagger 'Nimthanc' (2d4) (+4,+6) {superb level}
It cannot be harmed by the elements. It might have hidden powers.
i) a Small Sword of *Slay Evil* (1d6) (+8,+7) (+1) {WIS, regen, level}
It increases your wisdom by 1. It slays all evil creatures. It is
blessed by the gods and speeds your regeneration.
j) The Broad Sword 'Arunruth' (3d5) (+20,+12) (+4) {DEX+4}
It increases your dexterity by 4. It slays orcs and demons. It
provides resistance to cold. It slows your metabolism and makes you
fall like a feather. It grants you immunity to paralysis. It
activates for frost bolt (12d8) every 50 turns. It cannot be harmed
by the elements.
k) a Broad Sword of Westernesse (2d5) (+10,+12) (+1)
It increases your strength, dexterity, and constitution by 1. It
slays orcs, trolls, and giants. It grants you immunity to paralysis
and the ability to see invisible things.
l) The Battle Axe 'Lotharang' (2d8) (+4,+3) (+1) {STR,DEX,orc,troll,cure(level}
It increases your strength and dexterity by 1. It slays orcs and
trolls. It activates for cure wounds (4d8) every 3+d3 turns. It
cannot be harmed by the elements.
m) a Flail of *Slay Animal* (2d6) (+8,+4) (+2) {INT, metab, level}
It increases your intelligence by 2. It slays animals. It slows
your metabolism.
n) a Pick of Earthquakes (1d3) (+6,+17) (+7)
It increases your strength by 7. It increases your tunneling by 7.
It is branded with acid. It creates earthquakes on impact.
o) a Long Bow of Accuracy (x3) (+17,+13) {good level}
p) 19 Bolts of Acid (1d5) (+4,+8)
It is branded with acid. It cannot be harmed by acid.
q) 6 Bolts of Slay Demon (1d5) (+3,+9)
It slays demons.
r) 83 Bolts (1d5) (+0,+0)
s) 30 Arrows (1d4) (+5,+4)
t) 13 Arrows (1d4) (+3,+5) {Ufthak}
u) 13 Arrows (1d4) (+3,+3) {Grishnakh}
v) 17 Arrows (1d4) (+5,+1) {shop}
w) 31 Iron Spikes


[Options]

Adult: Maximize effect of race/class bonuses : yes (adult_maximize)
Adult: Randomize some of the artifacts (beta): no (adult_randarts)
Adult: Auto-scum for good levels : no (adult_autoscum)
Adult: Restrict the use of stairs/recall : no (adult_ironman)
Adult: Restrict the use of stores/home : no (adult_no_stores)
Adult: Restrict creation of artifacts : no (adult_no_artifacts)
Adult: Don't stack objects on the floor : no (adult_no_stacking)
Adult: Preserve artifacts when leaving level : no (adult_no_preserve)
Adult: Don't generate connected stairs : no (adult_no_stairs)
Adult: Monsters chase current location : yes (adult_ai_sound)
Adult: Monsters chase recent locations : yes (adult_ai_smell)
Adult: Monsters act smarter in groups : yes (adult_ai_packs)
Adult: Monsters learn from their mistakes : no (adult_ai_learn)
Adult: Monsters exploit players weaknesses : no (adult_ai_cheat)
Adult: Monsters behave more intelligently (broken): no (adult_ai_smart)
Score: Peek into object creation : no (score_peek)
Score: Peek into monster creation : no (score_hear)
Score: Peek into dungeon creation : no (score_room)
Score: Peek into something else : no (score_xtra)
Score: Know complete monster info : no (score_know)
Score: Allow player to avoid death : no (score_live)

momo125
January 9, 2008, 11:07
Gloves that provide FA or add to Dxt don't hamper your spellcasting abilty like other gloves do. The idea is that they are designed to allow free movement.

Mondkalb
January 9, 2008, 13:25
Walking around on level 32 (below level 20 in general) without free action might be deadly.
Buy a ring of free action at the black market or watch out for boots or gloves at the armory. If not available I would suppose wearing the dwarven armor or the westernesse weapon until you find another item with fa.

iaindb
January 9, 2008, 13:33
yes, I used the westernesse for general wandering, until I knew what monsters were in a particular room, then I'd swap to another weapon.

What ring should I drop - the STR+5 or DEX+4 ?

thanks.

Mondkalb
January 9, 2008, 13:39
Keep whichever gives you more blows with your weapon.
If no difference, I'd keep the strength ring for carrying capacity.

Zero
January 10, 2008, 03:18
Power vs. Extra Might: Assuming you are not playing a Ranger, as long as you don't get either disenchanted, Power is going to win (3x20 = 60, 4x11 = 44).

I only recently started playing Angband again, after many years. However, the last time I checked--which was long enough ago to ask if Angband was Y2K compliant--missile launchers only multiplied the base damage of missiles. For example, shooting a Rounded Pebble 1d2 (+0,+2) with a Sling x2 (+0,+1) would do 2d2+3, or 5-7, not 1d2+6, or 7-8.

Has this changed?

zaimoni
January 10, 2008, 07:51
I only recently started playing Angband again, after many years. However, the last time I checked--which was long enough ago to ask if Angband was Y2K compliant--missile launchers only multiplied the base damage of missiles. For example, shooting a Rounded Pebble 1d2 (+0,+2) with a Sling x2 (+0,+1) would do 2d2+3, or 5-7, not 1d2+6, or 7-8.

Has this changed?I'd have to check the source archives, but certainly as far back as the V2.9.x series missile launchers multiplied both base damage and damage bonuses by both the damage multiplier and the brand multiplier. This was what got O-style combat started; it intentionally has less effective missiles than V.

Melee weapons work as you state: only the base damage is multiplied by a melee brand.

zaimoni
January 10, 2008, 08:13
Missile weapons do not multiply damage bonuses in V2.6.2; they do in V2.7.8.

I don't have any intermediate versions' sources locally mirrored to check.

calenth
January 10, 2008, 08:25
Being somewhat in the same boat (enjoying an angband relapse with a dunedain ranger, although i don't think i've ever gotten a character past about level 35), the only thing I see right off is you should grab some enchant armor scrolls and enchant up your cloak and boots to +8 or +9 or so at least.

Otherwise, find some gauntlets that have free action or agility (I'm trying to do the same thing right now). Artifacts might count on this; I think you'll know if the gloves are ok because your mana won't drop when you put 'em on.

Zero
January 10, 2008, 14:43
certainly as far back as the V2.9.x series missile launchers multiplied both base damage and damage bonuses by both the damage multiplier and the brand multiplier.

Thanks for the update.

Wow, so if I had a Long Bow x3 (+X,+15) and an Arrow of Flame 1d4 (+Y,+15), the total damage would be ((3+3)*1)d4 + ((3+3)*(15+15)), or 6d4+180? Holy shit.

Psi
January 10, 2008, 15:55
Thanks for the update.

Wow, so if I had a Long Bow x3 (+X,+15) and an Arrow of Flame 1d4 (+Y,+15), the total damage would be ((3+3)*1)d4 + ((3+3)*(15+15)), or 6d4+180? Holy shit.
I may be wrong but I think it is:

3 * 3 * (1d4 + 15 + 15) = 9d4 + 270

Just imagine what you can do with a x5 or x6 bow with better ammo and plusses...

roustk
January 10, 2008, 18:45
Just imagine what you can do with a x5 or x6 bow with better ammo and plusses...

For example, my Half-Troll Mage (http://angband.oook.cz/ladder-show.php?id=7099) is getting ready to take on Morgoth and has:
* the Heavy Crossbow of Umbar (x4) (+18,+18) (+2)
* 30 Seeker Bolts of Holy Might (4d5) (+18,+24)

The (+2) on Umbar is "shooting power" and the only Morgoth slay is evil (x2), so the calculation here is:
((4+2)*(2)) * (4d5 +18 +24) = 12*4d5 + 504
Minimum damage for a hit is 552 and maximum is 744, with a suberb hit going to 2247.

For comparison, my melee weapon:
* Mace of Disruption 'Deathwreaker' (7d8) (+18,+18)

[EDIT: screwed up the slay calculation on Deathwreaker.]
The calculation is somewhat different, but still has the x2 slay evil:
(4 blows) @ ((2) * (7d8) + 56) = 2*28d8 + 224 per round
Minimum is 280, maximum is 672 per round.

If I'm doing the to-hit calculations right, I should be hitting about 5/8 of the time with either weapon (K is 309 for Deathwreaker and 319-dist for the Xbow, against Morgoth's 150 AC), so my 30 bolts should score about 20 hits before being destroyed by mana storms. That is some 12,000 damage, out of Morgy's 20,000.

(I'm at 4750' and almost out of uniques, so should be done this week.)

Kevin

roustk
January 10, 2008, 19:32
(I'm at 4750' and almost out of uniques, so should be done this week.)


Just took out Huan, the last non-questor unique, using: one out-of-LOS splash by mana storm, one (+9,+9) seeker arrow of frost (resisted), 17 (+13,+14) seeker arrows of venom (13 hits, not resisted) from Bard (x3+2,+17,+19), and 2 phase doors to hop away.

The arrows of venom would do (5*3)*(4d4+33) = 15*4d4+495 or 555 to 735 per round, so Huan's 8000 HP fell quickly.

Kevin

roustk
January 11, 2008, 01:40
(I'm at 4750' and almost out of uniques, so should be done this week.)


Winner -- see AAR thread (http://angband.oook.cz/forum/showthread.php?p=4830#post4830). I found Cubragol, so I took the 50% cut in shooting power (to x3 rather than x4+2) to increase burdened base speed to +29.

aeneas
January 15, 2008, 19:47
Thanks for the update.

Wow, so if I had a Long Bow x3 (+X,+15) and an Arrow of Flame 1d4 (+Y,+15), the total damage would be ((3+3)*1)d4 + ((3+3)*(15+15)), or 6d4+180? Holy shit.

That's pretty low damage for a V ranger actually (and would be low for any class, deep, except maybe a Priest who can stay in combat longer in compensation)... Let's say you have Bard, which is a x5 bow which is +19 to_dam (as far as I know it is not possible to get a x6 bow in V, at least without randarts). You are over clvl 40, so you get 3 shots. Your enemy is vulnerable to your branded ammo (which is 4d5 seeker, +15 to_dam of course... nothing but the best for _this_ ranger.. seeker bolts and cristal, all the way). In that case the total damage per round (assuming everything hits which is the normal way of calcing this, though it is not always the best way to do so) is 45*total damage... that is 45*(12+15+19). I could do the math, but I'd rather let you figure it out for yourself ;). And by the way.. that is conservative.. should actually be 12.5...

Note that this only holds if you have ammo that is x3 against your opponent. And also note that while that stratospheric damage is not possible for non-rangers, they can still do very well with a good bow- in NPP they can do almost that well, with the right randart- and in NPP rangers only get 2 shots. Check out an NPP rogue with a good sling of Buckland. I have one on the backburner, though he didn't find the sling until 4950'... Not as bad as a V ranger, but... the quiver really compensates.