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-   -   Brodha be Eeeevil? (http://angband.oook.cz/forum/showthread.php?t=10906)

syvana1 September 9, 2021 18:09

Brodha be Eeeevil?
 
Had a bit of luck in that my Necromancer found a staff of dispel Evil at level 10 however when I went to use it on Brodda the easterling a nasty piece of work who picks on defenseless women and children, it turned out he was too pure of heart to be effected. I guess they had it coming. (Playing 4.2.1)

Ingwe Ingweron September 9, 2021 22:02

Brodda may be a mean spirited bully in Bree, but he's pretty far down the totem pole as far as "evil" is concerned. There are many examples of this in Angband, Mim's children for example, may be misguided, but not "evil" like their dad.

Sphara September 9, 2021 22:34

Lots of really, really nasty enemies are not considered evil, as you get deeper in the dungeon.
Necromancer needs an alternative ways to kill enemies. By the time you meet the early orc chiefs (Lagduf, Grishnakh, Golfimbul), your nether bolt is not going to do the job.

Necromancer is a challenge class. Without a question, the hardest one to get it going (save great early luck).

archolewa September 9, 2021 23:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ingwe Ingweron (Post 155220)
There are many examples of this in Angband, Mim's children for example, may be misguided, but not "evil" like their dad.

I always felt sorry for Mim and dont understand how anyone can consider him "evil." He and his sons are all alone, the last of his people (a people incidentally who were genocided by elves). He is out looking for food when he gets captured by bandits, his son is murdered and he is forced to shelter the murderers of his son. Sure he betrays Turin and his band to the orcs, but *they murdered his son and stole his home.* Also, its not clear that he betrayed Turin willingly.

At worst the guy was angry and vengeful. He's certainly far less repugnant than Feanor.

Now credit to Tolkien, neither the Silmarillion nor Children of Hurin really try to excuse Turins behavior during the whole sorry episode.

Nick September 9, 2021 23:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by archolewa (Post 155222)
I always felt sorry for Mim and dont understand how anyone can consider him "evil." He and his sons are all alone, the last of his people (a people incidentally who were genocided by elves). He is out looking for food when he gets captured by bandits, his son is murdered and he is forced to shelter the murderers of his son. Sure he betrays Turin and his band to the orcs, but *they murdered his son and stole his home.* Also, its not clear that he betrayed Turin willingly.

At worst the guy was angry and vengeful. He's certainly far less repugnant than Feanor.

Now credit to Tolkien, neither the Silmarillion nor Children of Hurin really try to excuse Turins behavior during the whole sorry episode.

Well put. I always have a really hard time trying to sympathise with Turin at all.

Djabanete September 10, 2021 19:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ingwe Ingweron (Post 155220)
Brodda may be a mean spirited bully in Bree

It sounds like you are thinking about Bill Ferny from the Fellowship of the Ring, no?

T-Mick September 10, 2021 23:10

To help clarify the conversation: Brodda is an easterling who took over Hurin's land after the Battle of Unnumbered Tears. He's a petty dictator, murderer, slaver, and rapist. Hurin's son Turin kills him without much regret, and regretting killing people is Turin's specialty.

Ingwe Ingweron September 11, 2021 00:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Djabanete (Post 155253)
It sounds like you are thinking about Bill Ferny from the Fellowship of the Ring, no?

Ah, yes, you're right.

archolewa September 16, 2021 17:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick (Post 155226)
Well put. I always have a really hard time trying to sympathise with Turin at all.

It's interesting. While Children of Hurin is my least favorite of the Great Tales (so, so sad that's the only one that has a complete "modern" rendition, I would give anything for a full novelization of Beren and Luthien) I do find Turin to be an interesting character. He feels very *human*, stumbling from problem to problem of his own making, with brief moments where he understands they're of his own making, but he just can't seem to tame his worst impulses. The best he can do is temporarily redirect them to more constructive ends.

He feels like he's cut from the same cloth as Boromir, and Boromir is one of my favorite characters in LOTR.

Nick September 16, 2021 23:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by archolewa (Post 155379)
It's interesting. While Children of Hurin is my least favorite of the Great Tales (so, so sad that's the only one that has a complete "modern" rendition, I would give anything for a full novelization of Beren and Luthien)

The one I really mourn is the Fall of Gondolin. Rubbing salt in the wound, there is a beginning of a full rewrite of it in "Unfinished Tales", which is possibly my favourite piece of Tolkien's writing.


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