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-   -   Next competition (http://angband.oook.cz/forum/showthread.php?t=1086)

GenericPseudonym August 26, 2017 05:53

I agree that spending too much effort trying to curb cheating in an honor-system-based just-for-fun competition without any rewards is just silly. (And in any case people could always just edit the character dump to say whatever they want since it's just a text file.)

I will say though that (depending on how important/involved ID is in that particular variant), knowing these kinds of things can affect player enjoyment (as Gwarl said)
even if they don't make much of a difference to the integrity of the competition.

Ingwe Ingweron August 26, 2017 21:17

I always turn flavors off, anyway, and don't bother to remember which one was what. If it was something bad, like an early ?deep descent, the mangled scroll name is gone before I have the chance to memorize it. Although, I guess I could go back through the message list and see if it's there. I just never bother.

I do think it important that each comp player starts with the same town setup, shop contents, equipment and inventory, and stats. Where turncount matters, the location of home and shops relative to the stairs can make a difference. Contents of shops can certainly make a difference (e.g., a good sling).

As for the capability of having the same starting level by immediately descending the stairs, the only time I've ever used that was in the latest FA comp, but given all the blood and very few winners, I don't think it mattered at all.

HugoVirtuoso September 6, 2017 05:14

Nightmare-mode compo
 
For the future, I propose that we should have a Nightmare mode compo from a certain variant of Zangband, whether it's Z itself, Heng, or PCB 7.0.0. What do you think?

Gwarl September 8, 2017 16:11

October competition is already decided on, it's just a secret. And I'm pretty sure what December will be. November is up for discussion though, might see a Z or Heng comp there.

Gwarl February 4, 2018 21:41

I want to apologise to everyone for being late with this month's competition. I'm busy with exams, and it's going to be a couple of days until the new competition gets posted. There are complications with updating the competition on Live, it isn't quite a five minute job. Thanks for your patience.

HugoVirtuoso March 11, 2018 18:27

When the 1st official FrogComposband release arrives, make the next compo for it!

Gwarl May 5, 2018 12:34

Apologies for the delay!

Here's the shortlist of variants for the next comp:

angband feature/magic development branch
frogcomposband
sil-Q
hellband

These are going to be the next 4 competitions, not necessarily in that order.

Anyone who would like to see one of those sooner rather than later, make a post to let it be known.

I will try and get the competition up in the next couple of days but no promises.

Nick May 5, 2018 14:41

I'd say leave the feature/magic branch for now - there are some tweaks I want to do to it, and some 4.1.2 bugfixes that I want incorporated too. Maybe next one or the one after, we'll see how it goes.

konijn_ May 5, 2018 16:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gwarl (Post 129608)
Apologies for the delay!

Here's the shortlist of variants for the next comp:

angband feature/magic development branch
frogcomposband
sil-Q
hellband

These are going to be the next 4 competitions, not necessarily in that order.

Anyone who would like to see one of those sooner rather than later, make a post to let it be known.

I will try and get the competition up in the next couple of days but no promises.


Hellband last please ;)
I have a number of bug fixes that need testing and finalizing.

T.

Gwarl May 5, 2018 17:14

rodent/Sideways has also expressed misgivings. Quirk, is Sil-Q ready for another competion? :)

Quirk May 5, 2018 21:03

I've stuck in a couple of item rarity patches since the last release but it would nonetheless still probably serve for a competition; however I have the impression that most of December's players are still a little burned out from epic amounts of Sil-Q playing at the end of last year.

wobbly May 6, 2018 16:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quirk (Post 129629)
I've stuck in a couple of item rarity patches since the last release but it would nonetheless still probably serve for a competition; however I have the impression that most of December's players are still a little burned out from epic amounts of Sil-Q playing at the end of last year.

I would say that I'll play but I was planing on playing the O comp and that didn't happen.

ShadowTechnology August 30, 2018 04:14

So...
Will we have a new competition sometime soon?
Just askin'.

Gwarl August 30, 2018 13:10

Sorry. Yes.

Either tomorrow or the 1st of September.

ShadowTechnology August 30, 2018 15:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gwarl (Post 133141)
Sorry. Yes.

Either tomorrow or the 1st of September.

Cool. Thanks.

wobbly November 10, 2018 10:00

We appear to be comp-less. I'm going to suggest compos and save Gwarl from having to barrack for his own variant. Combat yeek chaos warrior, demon-realm if the new chaos deity mechanic is ready.

HugoVirtuoso November 10, 2018 20:02

To add to wobbly's suggestion: use Balo as Chaos patron, a.k.a. the bipolar chaos deity

Sky November 10, 2018 20:56

I suggest 4.1.3 with new classes. Druid maybe?

Gwarl November 12, 2018 17:40

A master branch druid might be a good idea, and having that followed up with a chaos warrior (the deity behaviour itself is pretty stable but there were unrelated problems with the last windows binary I uploaded).

I'll publish a new competition soon.

Sky November 12, 2018 21:05

Not TOO soon though. Ill have my pc next week so ... take your time.

Nick November 15, 2018 22:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gwarl (Post 134246)
A master branch druid might be a good idea.

Suits me - the druid has some new mechanics in the spells that I'd like feedback on. Also gives me an excuse to work on the new monster list rather than bugfix on the master branch ;)

Nick September 13, 2021 00:23

Gwarl and I have agreed that I'm going to run competitions for a bit. We've had a couple of threads fairly recently - here and here - what do people think next? Is it better to wait for 1.5.0 to come out before a Sil-q comp? The new FAangband should definitely wait for 2.0.1, because 2.0.0 has serious bugs.

Opinions welcome :)

HugoVirtuoso September 13, 2021 00:27

I'd say a 2-week Frogcomposband-nightly NON-Thrall Lucky Archon Rune-Knight should be next

Nick October 16, 2021 02:46

Competition 238 is up, and will take us into mid-November. After that I'm thinking another month-ish competition (Xygos, perhaps?), then hopefully a Sil-Q 1.5 comp in time for Christmas (presents!).

Nick November 13, 2021 22:51

What do people want next? Is Xygos ready for a competition, or something else?

Nick December 23, 2021 07:07

All right, so the plan was to do a Sil-q 1.5.0 comp for Christmas. Problems encountered so far:
  1. It's not released;
  2. Quirk is not currently around;
  3. I haven't played Sil for ages (and never Sil-q), so have no idea what a good character type is;
  4. I have only just made the connection between the fact I haven't done anything yet, and the date.
Thoughts? Advice?

wobbly December 23, 2021 07:49

I think it'd be fun to play the classical Sil 1.3. Whichever way you go Doriath or Finarfin if its a Singer. Any of the Noldor for warrior.

HugoVirtuoso December 23, 2021 14:12

Do Sil 1.3 for its throwback nostalgic Christmas �� gifts!

fph December 23, 2021 15:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by HugoTheGreat2011 (Post 156717)
Do Sil 1.3 for its throwback nostalgic Christmas �� gifts!

I also love them, but In retrospect they sound unusual... :D

"This game is very careful about Tolkien lore; it has a strict first-age setting and removes the unacceptable anachronisms and joke monsters that you may find in Angband. But, also, we added Christmas and Easter presents, woo!"

Nick January 3, 2022 23:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick (Post 156711)
All right, so the plan was to do a Sil-q 1.5.0 comp for Christmas.

Update: Sil-Q 1.5 is now out, and will be used for the next competition.

malcontent February 5, 2022 05:51

Is there any interest in a Vanilla competition with a poorly matched race and class? Not sure what I would suggest.

Dwarf/Necro? Ugh, Necromancer is terrible grind for 3/4 of the game regardless of race. Zero winners on the ladder for this combo. Maybe something more fun though...

Half-Troll/Anything? Not much of a stretch here - I think a Half-Troll is a decent race for any class, even the Int based casters like rogue and mage are very doable. And its always fun to just bash things at the start of game.

Half-Orc/Mage?

Gnome/Warrior?

HugoVirtuoso February 5, 2022 05:56

Half-Troll Paladin or Half-Troll Blackguard

(These are very random combos, but definitely should be interesting)

wobbly February 5, 2022 15:19

Half-troll paladin is a pretty strong combo.

How about kobold druid? Seems a fun combo

Thraalbee February 5, 2022 15:51

forced descent no recall hobbit paladin. must use a lance to kill Morgoth?

Estie February 5, 2022 16:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thraalbee (Post 157424)
forced descent no recall hobbit paladin. must use a lance to kill Morgoth?

Starting file and randart set, also a lance +0 given at start, also hobbit is only allowed to wield lances.

Thraalbee February 5, 2022 16:48

Yes! Burden is fun. ish. Not! Maybe? It'll be a great pain the all pack-rats out there (including me) so maybe know all runes from start to compensate somewhat?

wobbly February 5, 2022 17:11

Not sure hobbit paladin starts with enough str to wield a lance, might be heavy wield

Estie February 5, 2022 17:16

It is. Doesnt mean you cant kill stuff with it though.

Gwarl February 5, 2022 17:58

Composband 7.1.3 Dark Elf Hexblade ;)

HugoVirtuoso February 5, 2022 18:31

Now that Composband 7.1.3 has been released, make the next compo Composband related

Gwarl February 5, 2022 19:59

To be perfectly fair I don't mind if we choose something else while there's no windows build.

wobbly February 5, 2022 20:47

I can build for windows if its not in the next few days and I'm allowed to be lazy about it.

Nick February 6, 2022 02:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gwarl (Post 157431)
Composband 7.1.3 Dark Elf Hexblade ;)

So here's a plan:
  1. You put up a Compsband comp (you should still have access to the competition page, I assume) whenever you're ready;
  2. While that's running, I'll get V4.2.4 out and we can have a comp for that next.

Gwarl February 6, 2022 14:52

Here's a counter-offer;

I'm going away soon for a few weeks, and I want to wait for wobbly to make a windows build without rushing him; so I'll set up a hengband competition in the meantime and we'll pick the next competition based on whether we we have a windows build for composband or an angband release.

clouded February 6, 2022 17:06

Nice try Nick, but Gwarl is a slippery fellow.

wobbly February 6, 2022 18:24

Alternatively we could have a composband comp

https://github.com/MichaelCourtney/c...ses/tag/v7.1.3

for the windows binary. You might have to play around with the font setting if it looks blurry.

Also Gwarl, it'd be easier to compile if the relevant files weren't called frogcomposband.rc and frogcomposband.res

Nick February 6, 2022 21:13

This is like a game of chicken.

Gwarl February 7, 2022 00:05

There we go - Hengband competition. Now nobody has to make a new one for another 3 weeks.

Estie February 10, 2022 01:25

If it is still in the cards, I have a randart set with a good lance. The starting money of a gnome paladin is 3 gold short of being able to buy a lance; how an ironman gnome can survive with nothing but a lance (and a food ration which is in the inventory despite starting money option), I dont know.

Pete Mack February 10, 2022 01:44

You can trade stats for gold. Nevertheless, ironman hobbit with lance is an unlikely challenge.

wobbly February 10, 2022 07:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Estie (Post 157515)
If it is still in the cards, I have a randart set with a good lance. The starting money of a gnome paladin is 3 gold short of being able to buy a lance; how an ironman gnome can survive with nothing but a lance (and a food ration which is in the inventory despite starting money option), I dont know.

You can pretty much start the character with anything. Starting gear is set in class.txt and starting gold in constants.txt

Estie February 10, 2022 16:03

Thanks !

replaced
equip:sword:Main Gauche:1:1:none
with
equip:polearm:Lance:1:1:none

and checked starting gear option. It worked!

HugoVirtuoso March 9, 2022 05:45

Hellband compo, anyone? Gwarl?

Bill Peterson March 11, 2022 05:15

We did all the classes in Angband 4.2.0 a couple of years ago, what about going through all the races in Sil-Q?

Sil is won or lost so quickly you could cut the time down to a week, or even have another 24 hour competition.

malcontent March 23, 2022 20:18

Maybe a Vanilla Paladin competition to see if we can still break Single Combat :)

malcontent April 1, 2022 05:41

Maybe something challenging (and sadistic) like an ironman human necromancer?

Yuck, let's not. But maybe an ironman comp?

Nick April 5, 2022 23:37

I've had a suggestion to have a pair of successive competitions, 3.5.1 and 4.2.4, with the same race/class, point being to compare changes pre- and post-restructure.

Good idea? I'm thinking priest, maybe Dunadan.

Estie April 6, 2022 02:35

Can has randarts ?

Nick April 6, 2022 03:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Estie (Post 158162)
Can has randarts ?

Seems sensible.

Ingwe Ingweron April 6, 2022 03:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick (Post 158163)
Seems sensible.

If randarts, would we all have the same start file and randart file for the comp? I know for the past year or so, comps have foregone the start file that used to be integral to the experience, but without it the @s in the competition aren't really comparable.

Nick April 6, 2022 06:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ingwe Ingweron (Post 158164)
If randarts, would we all have the same start file and randart file for the comp? I know for the past year or so, comps have foregone the start file that used to be integral to the experience, but without it the @s in the competition aren't really comparable.

I would supply a starting savefile and encourage people to use it; that said, there's also been a push to encourage playing the comp on angband.live, which doesn't allow using the starting file.

So, kind of?

Estie April 6, 2022 17:43

Starting save file plus ranadart file should work fine ?

Ingwe Ingweron April 6, 2022 19:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick (Post 158165)
I would supply a starting savefile and encourage people to use it; that said, there's also been a push to encourage playing the comp on angband.live, which doesn't allow using the starting file.

So, kind of?

Yeah, for start files on angband.live, Gwarl used to have to make a separate angband entry just for the comp. Though having one dedicated comp entry on angband.live might not be a bad idea, if it were easy to do.

malcontent April 6, 2022 20:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ingwe Ingweron (Post 158171)
Yeah, for start files on angband.live, Gwarl used to have to make a separate angband entry just for the comp. Though having one dedicated comp entry on angband.live might not be a bad idea, if it were easy to do.

I haven't tried angband.live with 4.2.4 much - is it still pretty laggy for US west coast US folks?

malcontent April 6, 2022 20:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick (Post 158161)
I've had a suggestion to have a pair of successive competitions, 3.5.1 and 4.2.4, with the same race/class, point being to compare changes pre- and post-restructure.

Good idea? I'm thinking priest, maybe Dunadan.

I like the idea, except for the priest part. Is the feeling that a priest would better show the differences between the versions?

Nick April 6, 2022 22:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by malcontent (Post 158176)
I like the idea, except for the priest part. Is the feeling that a priest would better show the differences between the versions?

Yes, the general idea is to get a class that doesn't play too differently between the versions (so mage and ranger had big changes, for example), but still had spellcasting (so not a warrior). Priest seemed to fit the bill best, and we haven't had one for a while.

malcontent April 9, 2022 23:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick (Post 158177)
Yes, the general idea is to get a class that doesn't play too differently between the versions (so mage and ranger had big changes, for example), but still had spellcasting (so not a warrior). Priest seemed to fit the bill best, and we haven't had one for a while.

OK, I'm game :)

Nick June 5, 2022 09:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by clouded (Post 158464)
Can we have a Touhou Kattebatan comp next?

Can someone do a savefile for this?

Cryomaniac June 5, 2022 10:35

I can think of something; shouldn't we need a separate ladder first, though?

Nick June 5, 2022 12:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cryomaniac (Post 158600)
I can think of something; shouldn't we need a separate ladder first, though?

Good point.

Cryomaniac June 5, 2022 12:47

pav is the ladder maintainer, right?

Nick June 5, 2022 13:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cryomaniac (Post 158605)
pav is the ladder maintainer, right?

Yep, I've emailed him.

clouded June 5, 2022 16:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick (Post 158599)
Can someone do a savefile for this?

The game has score modifiers for everything so perhaps an anything goes competition could be fun, see how the score system works out. Cryomaniac can suggest some newbie friendly options to put in the description.

Cryomaniac June 5, 2022 16:28

The most 'newbie friendly' options would be hybrid classes that can perform well in melee and have some support abilities.

If you're using unique classes, that's Yuuka, Aya, Eiki, Toyosatomimi, Mayumi, Keiki, Momoyo, Yorihime + some others. If you're using standard race/class combos, Celestials/Shinigami/Great-Youkai have excellent racial bonuses, while Magic-Knights/Shugenja are good at melee and can study magic well, and Mindcrafters still have their 'toolbox' set of abilties with decent melee as well.

Nick June 6, 2022 13:09

OK, there's a ladder now. Somebody should:
  1. Try submitting a dump and
  2. Prepare a savefile

Cryomaniac June 6, 2022 13:12

Where do I submit? I don't see new variants on the ladder

EDIT: It won't be in the list until a new dump arrives, right?

Nick June 6, 2022 13:14

Correct; it should appear if you submit a dump.

Cryomaniac June 6, 2022 13:17

Posted here:

http://angband.oook.cz/ladder-show.php?id=25112

It didn't automatically mark it as 'dead', so I had to do it manually; what's the logic for this?

EDIT: Does it check for 'You were killed' string? This variant uses 'were defeated' instead

Nick June 6, 2022 13:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cryomaniac (Post 158618)
Posted here:

http://angband.oook.cz/ladder-show.php?id=25112

It didn't automatically mark it as 'dead', so I had to do it manually; what's the logic for this?

EDIT: Does it check for 'You were killed' string? This variant uses 'were defeated' instead

I'm not sure; I'll ping pav again.

Cryomaniac June 6, 2022 13:42

What should I do with the prepared savefile?

Nick June 6, 2022 13:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cryomaniac (Post 158621)
What should I do with the prepared savefile?

You can zip it and post it here, or email it to me (nckmccnnll at Google's mail service :)).

Also, think about what you want the win condition to be - standard is fastest winner (in turns), or if no winner max XP/turns. Given Henglikes usually use actual play time, you may want to do that; we can ask pav to set it up so the ladder order works correctly (and hopefully that will be possible).

Cryomaniac June 6, 2022 14:05

Sent an email with zipped savefile attached.

EDIT: On topic of victory conditions, I'll take the standard 'fastest winner' - with real play time taken into account, if possible.

Another important moment here: This mod has a bonus boss - defeating it marks you as '*TRUEWINNER*' instead of '***WINNER***'; the ladder should properly recognize those characters as winners as well, and if it's possible, they should be placed higher than ordinary winners. ToME 2.x.x already had a similar 'bonus boss' concept - does the ladder recognized victorious void-divers?

bron June 7, 2022 05:23

Regarding the "consistent randarts" versus "playing on angband.live" problem. For Vanilla at least, it seems like it should be a fairly simple mod (easy for me to say) to get the game to optionally accept the randart seed number as input at the character creation screen, which should allow the angband.live people to generate the same set of randarts.


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