Angband Forums

Angband Forums (http://angband.oook.cz/forum/index.php)
-   Variants (http://angband.oook.cz/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=4)
-   -   Brainstorming time - what should the character screen look like? (http://angband.oook.cz/forum/showthread.php?t=7098)

nppangband December 29, 2014 22:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by buzzkill (Post 97688)
Here's a (partial) screenshot of an actual spreadsheet I used for a winning DaJ character. Bare minimum required info, as this was entered and updated manually. I believe the first section is equipped items and ammo. Second section is carried swaps. Third is home inventory swaps.
More useful? YES. Somewhat confusing? Yes. Info still missing? yes.
If you could combine something like this with expanded mouseover info, I think you would really have something.

That can happen. We will also be able to use right-clicks, left-clicks, double-clicks, and mouse hovers to pull up different types of information.

I am working on the status-bar now, and am trying to make it as useful as possible. Everything is represented by icons, but a mouse hover gives a complete explanation equivalent to what is currently found in the help files. It is also interactive. You can click on the searching icon to start or stop searching, or clicking on the study icon opens up the dialog to learn spells.

EpicMan December 30, 2014 16:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Derakon (Post 97687)
In Vanilla, many resistances are variable. Each time you get hit by that element, damage gets cut by anywhere from 1/7th to 6/7ths.

Yes, this is utterly bizarre, thank you for noticing.

And is something that could be removed and 90+ percent of Angband players would probably never know. Since it's never explained in game (nor is it explained in the source code, it's just some weird magic numbers with no comments), changing the variable resists to the average (3.5/7, i.e. 1/2) would simplify things and keep the experience about the same for players. Right now the variable resistance adds complexity, but does it add enjoyment or interesting gameplay?

More radically, simplify things further - get rid of the high resistances (and add any protection from foo that would no longer be available) and cut high elemental damage in half. Items with high resists would get protections instead.

debo December 30, 2014 17:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by EpicMan (Post 97696)
And is something that could be removed and 90+ percent of Angband players would probably never know. Since it's never explained in game (nor is it explained in the source code, it's just some weird magic numbers with no comments), changing the variable resists to the average (3.5/7, i.e. 1/2) would simplify things and keep the experience about the same for players. Right now the variable resistance adds complexity, but does it add enjoyment or interesting gameplay?

More radically, simplify things further - get rid of the high resistances (and add any protection from foo that would no longer be available) and cut high elemental damage in half. Items with high resists would get protections instead.

"After the restructure" (you're welcome Nick)

Nick December 30, 2014 21:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by EpicMan (Post 97696)
And is something that could be removed and 90+ percent of Angband players would probably never know. Since it's never explained in game (nor is it explained in the source code, it's just some weird magic numbers with no comments), changing the variable resists to the average (3.5/7, i.e. 1/2) would simplify things and keep the experience about the same for players. Right now the variable resistance adds complexity, but does it add enjoyment or interesting gameplay?

One of the first things I want to look at is simplifying a whole range of calculations and making them more accessible to the player - to understand, and to change if they choose.

I don't think I would want to get rid of high resists; there are already unresistables, and I think having high resists makes for interesting gear choices.

nppangband December 31, 2014 00:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick (Post 97700)

I don't think I would want to get rid of high resists; there are already unresistables, and I think having high resists makes for interesting gear choices.

Plus, the biggest benefit of those resists is the prevention of the side effects like blindness, hallucinations, confusion, etc. The player would have to heal so much more frequently without those.

-Jeff

EpicMan December 31, 2014 19:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by nppangband (Post 97707)
Plus, the biggest benefit of those resists is the prevention of the side effects like blindness, hallucinations, confusion, etc. The player would have to heal so much more frequently without those.

-Jeff

I had envisioned replacing the high resists with the appropriate protection. But Nick is right - there are also irresistible elements distinct from the high ones, including time whose effects are not avoidable. No reason to blur that line, as time & mana are notable right now because you cannot resist them.

I would still advocate fixing high resists at 50% damage reduction instead of the current random protection.

nppangband January 3, 2015 04:59

The object flags and stat modifiers still need to be done, but here is the work-in-progress of the character screen. Each label has a tooltip with a detailed explanation of how it is calculated and the purpose in the game. In source-diving to make the tooltips I learned some things I never know(the hunger attack has a saving throw!?).

On a different note, if a brigand is a credit to the family, they need their own reality show pronto.

http://download.nppangband.org/char_screen.png

Tibarius January 4, 2015 00:09

character sheet
 
I like the character sheet basically as it is. It is easy to overlook and has a very good mix of Information density to clear structure.

If you want to make things easier to understand for players then make the resistances all the same. Resistance to an element = damage reduced to 1/2. Point. It is easy to take a half from some values in head. Make it always work that way, regardless if resistance comes from item or spell. You either have resistance or you don't have it.

OR makes resistances a number between 1 and 99. Which would multiply to reduce resistance. That way item and temporary resitance would add up without ever reaching immunity.
100% damage taken without anything
item gives 40% reduction=>
damage taken = 100 * (100-40)/100 = 60% of full damage
2nd item gives 20% reduction=>
damage taken = 100 * (100-40)/100 * (100-20)/100 = 48% of full damage
spell gives temporary another 50% reduction=>
damage taken = 100 * (100-40)/100 * (100-20)/100 * (100-50)/100 = 24%
of full damage taken
That way it does not matter in which order the modifiers are applied. Cast Spell first and wear item or the other way round, it always Comes out the same.

The charachter sheet would Show the % damage taken ... 100 without resistance and the reduced value if resistance is applied.

I still have no clue what "saving throw %" is good for tho. Does this partially replace the protections? If i have 100% saving throw with high stats, does i still Need pBlind for example?

Cheers,
Tibarius

nppangband January 4, 2015 01:03

After playing around with it for a while, I came to the same conclusion. The character screen doesn't need to be all that different. I am trying to work in as much information as possible. Although it doesn't show up in the screen shot, almost every label has a ToolTip that gives extremely detailed information.

With regard to the different resistances, they are unique because each breath attack does different things. The most dangerous thing about the chaos breath is the hallucination and confusion side effects. Having resist chaos stops the side effects. It is far more important than the damage reduction.

In terms of saving throw, here is the tooltip. Note Vanilla Angband might be slightly different:

Current Saving throw percentage against some monster magical attacks such as fear, paralysis, slowness, blindness, and confusion. It is based on player race, class, level, and wisdom. Note some monster attacks do not allow a saving throw, so even a perfect saving throw doesn't offer complete protection from these side effects.

Zireael January 10, 2015 19:09

I love that character screen! Can't wait to playtest!


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 21:47.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, vBulletin Solutions Inc.