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-   -   No Sell - I am convinced (http://angband.oook.cz/forum/showthread.php?t=4550)

Jazerus June 26, 2011 21:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by d_m (Post 55982)
I could imagine using CHR in that way, although I doubt it will make anyone prioritize CHA any higher.

I think that "making CHA useful" will require some kind of large (possibly variant-esque) change to the game, e.g. summoning.

Though I still wouldn't prioritize charisma over the other stats (other than INT/WIS as the classes that don't use them) it would at least be a reason to be mildly happy when finding a !Charisma. At this point giving charisma any value at all is a good thing; making the ambitious leap of trying to make it a priority stat in some cases doesn't have to be the first step in making it not worthless.

bulian June 26, 2011 21:41

Just to be clear, my post was about the additional strategic component that selling adds, not about the general availability of gold. I'm confident the additional gold drops with no selling can be tuned to a point where the gold availability is even if its not already.

While loans sound interesting, layaway seems more attractive to the shopkeeprs. With loans, the player could buy all consumables they need, go deep into debt for the shopkeeper's best item, and then die in the dungeon. With layaway, the shopkeeper doesn't sell the item for a "week" and can sell it if the player doesn't come back in time. If I were a shopkeeper I know which one I would do.

Mortgaging the house is an interesting idea, but I think a powerful strategy would be to mortgage the entire house initially for a large chunk of gold to get a really good head start. At least, that's what I would do. The alternate, to let the character buy the home and/or barn, patio, front porch, attic, garage, and super secret hideout to enable additional late game storage space, is interesting as a late game gold sink (is 3 additional slots worth 100k AU?), though this seems variant territory.

EpicMan June 27, 2011 04:32

I enjoy the decision of whether to sell some of my gear (esp. Artifacts) for a really good / important item. I wouldn't say I would refuse to play no-selling, though. And I think either the layaway option or the debt option would cover my one interesting sell scenario.

Starhawk June 30, 2011 17:42

I'm in the middle of my first no-selling game, and I'm still on the fence.

I like that gold drops are now meaningful amounts. In selling games, I ignored most gold on the floor unless it was directly in my path. In no-selling, it's worth a detour to pick up. Coinage becomes flavorful and significant, which is good.

I don't like the frustration no-selling adds to finding a good item that I won't be able to use. For instance, yesterday: I'm attacking with an enchanted rapier for 70 points a round, and I find a nice ego maul. The maul will do less damage because I only get one attack a round. In a selling game, I get the satisfaction of carting it back, turning it into AU, and buying something I want. In a no-selling game, I sigh and dump it on the floor. Lame.

I like having more inventory slots free to pick up useful consumables that I wouldn't normally carry in a selling game.

But I don't like the lack of choices to make in town. I was short 4000 gold for the first statgain potion I saw in the Black Market. In a selling game, I could have chosen to give up some equipment to get the statgain potion -- an interesting and difficult choice, and one that I think has been mentioned earlier in the thread. In my no-selling game, I had to jump back to the dungeon and hope for gold drops (and the potion had been recycled by the time I got the gold). Frustrating.

ekolis June 30, 2011 23:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Starhawk (Post 56274)
But I don't like the lack of choices to make in town. I was short 4000 gold for the first statgain potion I saw in the Black Market. In a selling game, I could have chosen to give up some equipment to get the statgain potion -- an interesting and difficult choice, and one that I think has been mentioned earlier in the thread. In my no-selling game, I had to jump back to the dungeon and hope for gold drops (and the potion had been recycled by the time I got the gold). Frustrating.

Random idea out of nowhere - what if you could "reserve" an item in the stores? That is, pay some fraction of the item's price now, and by doing so the item is not destroyed when the store restocks - come back and pay the rest of the price later!

Netbrian July 1, 2011 01:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by ekolis (Post 56287)
Random idea out of nowhere - what if you could "reserve" an item in the stores? That is, pay some fraction of the item's price now, and by doing so the item is not destroyed when the store restocks - come back and pay the rest of the price later!

Damn -- I like this idea a lot. I really do think it fixes most of the concerns people have with no selling (other than the "no consolation prizes for unusable equipment" problem.)

dos350 July 1, 2011 02:31

its a joke!

why bother making changes to make a change that isnt even meaningful or good to work more like it was before the change?

i think more thinking is required,

please , no rage!~

Djabanete July 1, 2011 03:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Magnate (Post 55553)
Wow, you are lucky. I developed the standing-on-stairs technique after losing dozens of chars to OOD monsters in the first few dlevs - baby dragons being particularly difficult for low level chars to get away from or defeat.

I am similarly paranoid, Magnate, but I take it up a notch: I only read unidentified scrolls if the staircase I'm on is also in a dead end.

Raggy July 1, 2011 10:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Starhawk (Post 56274)

I don't like the frustration no-selling adds to finding a good item that I won't be able to use. For instance, yesterday: I'm attacking with an enchanted rapier for 70 points a round, and I find a nice ego maul. The maul will do less damage because I only get one attack a round. In a selling game, I get the satisfaction of carting it back, turning it into AU, and buying something I want. In a no-selling game, I sigh and dump it on the floor. Lame.

I usually dump said item in my house, and hope any stat gain pots (or shuffle ones) will give me enough blows, so the maul gets better.


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