Angband Forums

Angband Forums (http://angband.oook.cz/forum/index.php)
-   Vanilla (http://angband.oook.cz/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=3)
-   -   Blackguards: 4.2.0 to 4.2.1 (http://angband.oook.cz/forum/showthread.php?t=9901)

DavidMedley June 3, 2020 01:25

It's already up on Github and Angband.live!

Nick June 3, 2020 01:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by DavidMedley (Post 146001)
It's already up on Github and Angband.live!

and in the latest nightly build, in fact.

DavidMedley June 3, 2020 02:40

Is that here?
https://rephial.org/nightlies

It's been "under construction" for a while, I thought intentionally.

mrfy June 3, 2020 03:00

I still have a few concerns with the spells. The ones that give a certain number of blows are confusing. Leap into Battle says it gives 4 blows, Whirlwind Attack 3 blows, Maim Foe 3 blows, Forceful Blow 1 blow. Current weapon gives 5 blows per round for a ton of damage. So why would I use these spells?

Relentless taunting doesn't seem to be doing much. Hard to tell, but they seem to be casting, summoning friends, etc the same whether I cast the spell or not.

As a level 50 Blackguard, I'm finding the only useful spells to be Unholy Reprieve and Forceful Blow to send them away from you. My melee weapon is so good that it feels it is better than activating werewolf form.

Nick June 3, 2020 03:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by DavidMedley (Post 146003)
Is that here?
https://rephial.org/nightlies

It's been "under construction" for a while, I thought intentionally.

The under construction sign is always there, but there should also be a list of recent builds - I'm not sure why that isn't currently showing. You can see that list here.

DavidMedley June 3, 2020 04:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrfy (Post 146004)
I still have a few concerns with the spells. The ones that give a certain number of blows are confusing. Leap into Battle says it gives 4 blows, Whirlwind Attack 3 blows, Maim Foe 3 blows, Forceful Blow 1 blow. Current weapon gives 5 blows per round for a ton of damage. So why would I use these spells?

Relentless taunting doesn't seem to be doing much. Hard to tell, but they seem to be casting, summoning friends, etc the same whether I cast the spell or not.

As a level 50 Blackguard, I'm finding the only useful spells to be Unholy Reprieve and Forceful Blow to send them away from you. My melee weapon is so good that it feels it is better than activating werewolf form.

Hey, thanks for the feedback.

The blows spells are still somewhat useful with light weapons. Leap is still very useful for closing gaps, Whirl can still deliver extra blows against multiple adjacent foes, the stun from Maim has many benefits, and Forceful Blow does 200 pts force damage and throws the enemy back.

To your point, though, when you find a light weapon that is much better than your other options the blows spells are a bit disappointing. One of the goals was to give BGs incentive to use big heavy weapons and I'm not entirely pleased with the way I did it.

Relentless Taunting almost certainly does cut in half the chances of a monster using an ability: https://github.com/angband/angband/s...scoped_q=taunt If you've run experiments and it's not working, I'd be very interested to hear that. It also affects their movement, but there are several factors that I don't fully understand yet. Taunt is completely irresistible and I've bumped the duration to 12+d12. It seems to be popular from the feedback I've received.

In werewolf form you're still using your melee weapon. You can see it via the I key. You get 1 extra blow per round and +1 footspeed, which usually doubles your movement speed. It's completely at-will; you can get out of it for no SP or time. Very handy, especially if the other spells aren't your cup of tea.

Berserk Strength should be beneficial at all levels if you're meleeing. Maim is definitely worth giving up 2 blows for vs stunable enemies that you can't kill in 2 rounds or less. Quake can break LoS and will keep enemies from summoning even better than Taunt.

I hope some of that helps!

DavidMedley June 3, 2020 04:12

To quote myself:
Quote:

Originally Posted by DavidMedley (Post 144544)
It might surprise you how effective stun is. I have written down: "Damage reduced 25%. Accuracy reduced 25%. 10% chance to miss a turn. Gives player +10 to-hit for crit calc only. See mon-timed.h and test_hit in player-attack.c." It might do other things, too. But at a minimum it's very effective at reducing the damage you take in melee combat.


mrfy June 3, 2020 06:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by DavidMedley (Post 146006)
The blows spells are still somewhat useful with light weapons. Leap is still very useful for closing gaps, Whirl can still deliver extra blows against multiple adjacent foes, the stun from Maim has many benefits, and Forceful Blow does 200 pts force damage and throws the enemy back.

I've given up carrying the first book since I wasn't using the spells much, if at all, in favor of another inventory spot. I did use Whirl a lot for a while, but groups of monsters now are either too easy, or dangerous enough that I want to fight them singularly.

Quote:

To your point, though, when you find a light weapon that is much better than your other options the blows spells are a bit disappointing. One of the goals was to give BGs incentive to use big heavy weapons and I'm not entirely pleased with the way I did it.
My current weapon is 28 lbs, with a lot of extras so it's been my primary for quite a while.

Quote:

Relentless Taunting almost certainly does cut in half the chances of a monster using an ability: https://github.com/angband/angband/s...scoped_q=taunt If you've run experiments and it's not working, I'd be very interested to hear that. It also affects their movement, but there are several factors that I don't fully understand yet. Taunt is completely irresistible and I've bumped the duration to 12+d12. It seems to be popular from the feedback I've received.
I've been trying to activate it consistently before getting into battles. Perhaps it is less effective against Great Wyrms and Archliches and Ainu(s) and high-level uniques. Or it's just observer bias, I notice when the monsters cast/summon because I'm watching for it.

Quote:

In werewolf form you're still using your melee weapon. You can see it via the I key. You get 1 extra blow per round and +1 footspeed, which usually doubles your movement speed. It's completely at-will; you can get out of it for no SP or time. Very handy, especially if the other spells aren't your cup of tea.
I'll look at it again, but while you can switch out of the mode, it does take another turn to turn back into werewolf. I don't expect it to take no time, but it is a consideration. For example, lengthy battle, you have opponent slowed, you're sped up, turn into werewolf, attack, monster speeds back up, exit from werewolf, hit him again with slow monster, then have to take the extra turn to change back to werewolf.

Quote:

Berserk Strength should be beneficial at all levels if you're meleeing. Maim is definitely worth giving up 2 blows for vs stunable enemies that you can't kill in 2 rounds or less. Quake can break LoS and will keep enemies from summoning even better than Taunt.
Ok, next Into the Shadows book I find I'll try out some of the spells again.

FWIW, I never use Quake, even against Morgoth.

Thanks for the response. :)

DavidMedley June 3, 2020 06:41

I appreciate the report and I'm definitely listening. I'll have more opportunities to watch people when 4.2.1 is published, too.

The code for reducing enemy casting via Taunt is incredibly simple. None of the things you've mentioned could have an effect.

Are you meleeing enemies? How do you get close to them? Leap, Taunt and Werewolf are all meant to reduce the pain of closing the gap (and Quake, kinda). They can each reduce enemy ranged attacks by 2-4 times! And Taunt can stack with the other two.

Kusunose June 3, 2020 14:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick (Post 146005)
The under construction sign is always there, but there should also be a list of recent builds - I'm not sure why that isn't currently showing. You can see that list here.

The list is blocked from loading because it is mixed content, i.e. an HTTP content inside an HTTPS content. Here is the error message from the Chrome developer console.

Quote:

Mixed Content: The page at 'https://rephial.org/nightlies' was loaded over HTTPS, but requested an insecure frame 'http://buildbot.rephial.org/builds/master/builds.html'. This request has been blocked; the content must be served over HTTPS.
Firefox and Edge also block the list. You need to change the link to builds.html with https protocol.


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 14:29.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, vBulletin Solutions Inc.