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Old May 7, 2012, 17:24   #37
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 64
CliffStamp is on a distinguished road
Originally Posted by PowerDiver View Post
I find that the game has been ruined. In the pursuit of making the game shiny and accessible to new players, they have ruined it for experts. .
Without getting into a debate on communism vs fascism, groups can be made to function as a cohesive unit with use of a clear vision and mission statement. The group then works towards this and members can come in and out of the group and it should be fairly stable as you are getting an average or smearing effect which is much more robust than one maintainer coming and going. Ideally this vision and mission statement are public and can be of course discussed by the group, I think you very clearly stated the vision of Angband proper.

As for the change was it just difficulty or were the actual mechanics changes? I agree that difficulty or in more general times balance is a line which once crossed the game can be almost ruined. i am not sure though that someone being able to understand the mechanics in three months is a sign of issues. I don't recall it taking three months for me to understand, but that was quite a long time ago. I started in 94 in the glory days of mages being greater fighters than warriors once they were booked out and having the ability to cast GoI at will.

The biggest problem with Angband is a few key points which you have really pushed to an extreme in game pace :

1) the goal isn't to kill everything, it is to kill one (ok 2) things so the sub-goal is to get level/kit

Now with this in mind it quickly becomes obvious :

a) the game is about resource management, make clw equal to healing and scrolls of teleport other equal to *genocide* (genocide + wod on uniques) and watch how trivial the game becomes

b) getting levels/kit is exactly about getting levels and kit and not killing everything

Once you get these two points you develop a basic strategy which is :

i) horde all resources and do not waste them on trivial engagements (!, ?, Z, r, etc.)

ii) detect, salvage (rinse and repeat)

Now you move onto small refinements such as for example as you advance things which were thought to be useless are not. For example infravision is usually neglected by a novice, but an advanced player who would get +6 infra early would see it as a godsend. Telport other is basically = empty vault of all monsters and make it a store with zero cost.

Again it simply is part of the detect + salvage strategy. I carried out a few experiments with this early by doing things like taking a priest once they had wod, and even a mage who found a staff of same and just went right to d98 and just destructed until I was full kit. You you miss ros, bos, etc. but that doesn't matter they will roll up again.

Once you have full artifact kit of your choice you can now relax on wod and actually clear to get the rings, boots, etc. as required and then fill out the potion, scroll list. This however makes the game fairly trivial and it could be argued that you are actually breaking game play mechanics.

This is why I argued (long time ago when I first did it, in the nineties) that wod should have a chance to break artifacts on the level and that genocide would drain max hp when you use it. This would move them back to being emergency management and not ultra-scum techniques.

But Angband (and the variants) has always had this if you are willing to exploit it. It is no different than for example in Heng (and variants) where some people scum for eat magic as the starting mutation for beastman which is insanely powerful. Or to a lesser extend ensure all characters start with a white aura.

The list goes on with things like farming which is why I noted that all summoned/cloned monsters should have no drops and give no exp because if you want you can simply turn a venom wyrm (or law if you don't have clone) into a bunch of scrolls of *acquirement*.

But back to the beginning, is there some list/thread which raises points of objection or even a change log (non-bug related).
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