Sil 1.0.2

[Jungle_Boy]

The problem with making a lantarn is that it doesn't come pre-filled and I always seem to find other lantarn before I do flasks.

[Scatha]

debo: apart from the Jeweller's options, there are Helms and Swords of Brilliance. It needs two abilities, but I think Armoursmith and Enchantment is a reasonable start for smiths.

Originally Posted by jujuben

Violet molds are annoying, yes, but they make for some interesting early choices. Invest in smithing for a better light source and/or "con for the sustain? Keen senses? Pure combat and take your chances on avoiding them or finding con or restoration before you get into anything too nasty? Sil is all about non-trivial choices. Having a few of them early makes for a better game.

I think this is really the key point. They're an interesting obstacle to interact with, or work out a strategy for. Even just increasing your Will to a moderate score before they start showing up is fairly effective. Also note that the arrow trick (very clever, by the way!) isn't free: you pay turns and arrows (they can break), and if you're aiming for stealth you might accidentally alert creatures you didn't want to.

That said we have tried to make optimal gameplay coincide with interesting gameplay (avoiding boring/repetitive strategies being too good), and the arguments that the violet molds are a problem because they encourage repeatedly engaging in things like firing arrows down corridors (as opposed to because it's annoying having your Con drained) have some substance. My feeling is that it's a short enough part of the game, and there is enough interest in working out when to try such measures, that it's okay as it is, but this could be worth watching.

Incidentally I definitely think the game is improved by sometimes having to adventure with your stats drained, rather than it just being a trap for new players. It can move you out of your comfort zone, force you to change your priorities and risk assessments, etc. Perhaps the problem is that it's too easy to avoid the violet molds? Maybe they should be invisible ...

[jujuben]

I definitely use the helm of brilliance on most smithing builds. Haven't really done the early weaponsmith route beyond the minimal 300xp free basic kit for an otherwise non-smithing feanorian. If I'm playing a jeweler, I'll sometimes even forge an AoBR -1 for the light radius. I haven't found a controllable -1 grace to be too big of an issue, and early light is very very nice.

[decoy]

Stat-drainers in general can be brutal. Violet molds can be bad, but the brutal one (which thankfully I've only come across once) is one of the fast bugs catching you in the open. If you've got armor or will this is perhaps no big deal, but if you have neither and you end up losing all your Dex, for example, it's probably game over. It's Sil, though--this is to be expected.

[WaveMotion]

Thanks for the tips on violet molds. I'm sure I'll come to regard them as not as big of a deal as I see more of the game.

Another question for the devs: Have you guys considered letting the player modify options globally such that they apply for every game? I got tired of loading a pref file at the start of every game, so I copied one of my characters' dumps into lib/pref and changed pref.prf to have it as a subfile. It feels like a clunky workaround, though. (EDIT: And it doesn't seem to work consistently!)

EDIT2: Upon code-diving, I found that I'd get better results with importing into user.prf instead of pref.prf. But I still think an in-game interface to do this would be nice.
EDIT3: Importing into user.prf doesn't help either. Urgh.

[debo]

Originally Posted by decoy

Stat-drainers in general can be brutal. Violet molds can be bad, but the brutal one (which thankfully I've only come across once) is one of the fast bugs catching you in the open. If you've got armor or will this is perhaps no big deal, but if you have neither and you end up losing all your Dex, for example, it's probably game over. It's Sil, though--this is to be expected.

Dragonflies always surprise me w the amount of HP they have - I always expect them to have 1d4 hit die like the early bugs. This leads to some stupid mistakes on my part...

[debo]

Has anyone tried playing a throwing-focused character? What about a polearm-focused character? If so, I'd be curious to see builds / dumps -- these are two variations on play I don't think anyone has really tried much at all, but perhaps I'm wrong?

[debo]

Also, a couple of potential tweak ideas:

- If an opponent is unwary and you have opportunist, your character should opt not to attack if the opponent moves away. I can't think of a situation where you'd want opportunist to trigger on an unwary opponent, and this has come close to killing me a few times now.

- I use Assassinate a lot, and I've noticed that being in Stealth Mode ('S') keeps the +5 stealth bonus on your attack roll. Since switching to Stealth Mode does not require turns, wouldn't it be merciful just to always apply that +5 no matter what? Right now, I always check the bottom display before I attack. Once you get focused attack, this is even more annoying b/c you have to do 'S'+'z'+attack. Unless there are macros in Sil, then the problem is already solved

[Scatha]

Originally Posted by debo

Has anyone tried playing a throwing-focused character? What about a polearm-focused character? If so, I'd be curious to see builds / dumps -- these are two variations on play I don't think anyone has really tried much at all, but perhaps I'm wrong?

I've got somewhere before now with polearms (e.g. http://angband.oook.cz/ladder-show.php?id=12356), and think they have the potential to be pretty strong. I often keep spears as a ranged attack alternative for when I don't want to invest in archery, but I haven't tried so much making that the focus of the character.

Originally Posted by debo

Also, a couple of potential tweak ideas:

- If an opponent is unwary and you have opportunist, your character should opt not to attack if the opponent moves away. I can't think of a situation where you'd want opportunist to trigger on an unwary opponent, and this has come close to killing me a few times now.

There certainly are some cases where you might want to do this (wandering monster moving at the same speed as you, Opportunist could be the only way to get Focused Attack on them), but it could be that this is rare enough to warrant changing the default behaviour. It doesn't weaken the ability much to make this change, but it does complicate it a little to have the exception.

- I use Assassinate a lot, and I've noticed that being in Stealth Mode ('S') keeps the +5 stealth bonus on your attack roll. Since switching to Stealth Mode does not require turns, wouldn't it be merciful just to always apply that +5 no matter what? Right now, I always check the bottom display before I attack. Once you get focused attack, this is even more annoying b/c you have to do 'S'+'z'+attack. Unless there are macros in Sil, then the problem is already solved

Stealth mode makes you slow! If you attack an unwary regular speed foe without stealth mode, if they survive they spend their turn noticing you and you get the next action. With stealth mode you are more likely to kill them on the initial attack, but if you fail they'll get to act before you.

[half]

I've made a few changes to 1.0.3 in light of these recent comments (I read all of them!):

- zone of control & opportunist no longer attack unwary creatures
- zone of control, opportunist, flanking and controlled retreat no longer attack during the truce

(in both cases this is almost always the desired effect, and it is often a surprise to the player when it doesn't happen)

- violet molds are half as common again (there were already twice as rare as other molds)

- dragonfly health has been reduced in line with other insects
- all insects/centipedes now have 2d4 health and gain their defence primarily from evasion/protection