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Old July 30, 2010, 18:57   #11
PowerDiver
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Quote:
Originally Posted by d_m View Post
I actually kind of want to remove the "Satisfy Hunger" spell for this reason. Right now food is basically just a penalty for playing a Warrior (or being low level). Either it's an interesting problem (and everyone should do it) or it's tedious (in which case warriors shouldn't need to be the only ones annoyed by it).
I agree 100%, except that I would word it differently. Scrolls of satisfy hunger are not a problem. The problem is that the spell is in books that spellcasters always carry. The spell does not need to be removed from the game, just removed from the books.

I have been playing for a few months with the restriction of never casting satisfy hunger from a book. Unfortunately, I believe my play style means that my experience with this is of dubious value generalizing to others.

Food was originally, i.e. in the very first roguelike, introduced to force diving over level clearing. Limited amount of food per game means you cannot afford long fight-a-bit-then-rest-and-repeat tactics. Since the intent has been removed, I think the mechanic should be removed as well.
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Old July 30, 2010, 19:02   #12
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Originally Posted by TJS View Post
Who is to say that half-trolls won't be given regen for both types?
Care to place a wager? It sounds to me as if the reason this was introduced is that someone didn't think trolls should regen mana.

After all, 2 half-trolls listed in the top 50 mages on the angband ladder is far too many. Such a travesty needs to be addressed.

We should also give high-elf mages an extra boost to make sure the proportion never gets this close again.
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Old July 30, 2010, 19:39   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by d_m View Post
I actually kind of want to remove the "Satisfy Hunger" spell for this reason. Right now food is basically just a penalty for playing a Warrior (or being low level). Either it's an interesting problem (and everyone should do it) or it's tedious (in which case warriors shouldn't need to be the only ones annoyed by it).
For me food wasn't a substantial penalty playing a warrior. By the time I can recall at will I could just gorge in the town, fuel lantern to 15000, and carry neither food nor oil. In practice I carried a ration and dropped it in the dungeon, or gorged again when safe. I found I wanted to sell/stash in the town more often than I got hungry.

I don't mean to speak a heresy, but why not just eliminate food/hunger? In the early game food is cheap and you don't need the slot, soon most classes have ready access to the spell, the rest can follow the mechanic I prescribe.
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Old July 30, 2010, 19:49   #14
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@Eddie--
nobody is going quite so far as that. The only proposal of the sort I saw here was to nerf H-T casters a bit more and to give an extra bump to gnome mages. Giving the bump to High-Elf Mage really is a step too far.
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Old July 30, 2010, 19:55   #15
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Originally Posted by nullfame View Post
why not just eliminate food/hunger?
The suggestion has been made before. Food is only really an issue in an Ironman game, and even then mostly just for Warriors. I support the idea: unlike the original Rogue (where dying of starvation was a very real possibility), food is just an annoyance in Angband.
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Old July 30, 2010, 20:04   #16
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I could get behind removing food from the game. I typically completely miss the messages telling me that I've become hungry, and frequently make it all the way to Weak before I remember to eat.

The only time I've seen hunger be remotely interesting as a mechanic is one of ToME 2's traps, which takes you straight to Weak like a potion of Salt Water. Otherwise it's merely an annoyance.

As for the nerfing of trolls, well, they're already one of the best physical races in the game, with massive STR and CON, physical regeneration, and sustained strength. It's really bizarre that they also have one of the best mental attributes as well. That said, I don't expect this change will be incorporated anytime soon (if ever) largely because of the character sheet issues.
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Old July 30, 2010, 20:10   #17
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The suggestion has been made before. Food is only really an issue in an Ironman game, and even then mostly just for Warriors. I support the idea: unlike the original Rogue (where dying of starvation was a very real possibility), food is just an annoyance in Angband.
To be honest. Constant dying of hunger was one of the main reasons I dropped Nethack in favor of Angband. Angband was a lot friendlier with regards to starvation, and it really helped me get past the initial hump and learn how to play the game.

Hunger is an annoyance for sure, but it's an inventory management annoyance. A slight one for sure, but one nonetheless. I wouldn't mind chucking satisfy hunger entirely, but I'd also like to see food drops increase in the dungeon.
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Old July 30, 2010, 20:10   #18
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But to try and get back on topic: I like the idea of splitting REGEN_HP and REGEN_SP. While something like, e.g. an Amulet of Regeneration, should have both, I can see that the split would be interesting in other items.

For me personally, its a minor matter since I don't generally care much about the turn counter, and Resting-to-regenerate takes the same amount of real time regardless of the number of game turns. Increasing the number of "abilities" does tend to suggest that more things should have the "random extra abilities" flag. Or possibly more than one extra ability.
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Old July 30, 2010, 20:11   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete Mack View Post
@Eddie--
nobody is going quite so far as that. The only proposal of the sort I saw here was to nerf H-T casters a bit more and to give an extra bump to gnome mages. Giving the bump to High-Elf Mage really is a step too far.
I think he was being ironic.
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Old July 30, 2010, 20:15   #20
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If regen becomes cumulative then warriors could be given health regen and half-trolls extra regen on top of that. That would make up for the fact that warriors are missing out on SP regen.

Mind you I think that warriors should get some SP for prayers at high clvl and wisdom so they could benefit from that as well.
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