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Old April 22, 2019, 04:10   #41
Estie
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One of the guides that I read say that Chaos resistance is vital for depths below D:54, as the chaos breaths can screw up a character’s run quickly. I also thought that Stealth maxes out at Superb, based on what I read, at least for this version. Or can it go even further?
Stealth; every 3 points of it halve the chance of waking up a sleeping monster. Running around with legendary stealth is quite the experience.

Chaos: there are dangerous chaos breathers like great wyrms and jabberwocks, but youre not going to engage those yet whether you have resist or no - they would kill you. Luckily they are usually asleep, especially when you have good stealth.
More dangerous are chaos vortices, as they are always awake, hard to detect, fast and find you from all over the map. They are completely harmless with chaos resitance but can be annoying without - it might be worthwhile to teleport them away instead of fighting even though they have very few hitpoints. As usual, frequent detection is the solution to not getting into trouble.

So, chaos resistance is certainly nice to have, but so are rsistance to disenchantment or pconf. All of these are luxury resists.

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Is the items that Duntir’s wearing the correct setup that he should follow? Or is there some other attribute that I should prioritize? I could see myself wearing the elvenkind armor again if persuaded to do so.
I would certainly wear the elvenkind for the stealth, but it is a small matter. Your current setup is fine, too.

The bonus from constitution is non-linear; with low base value, adding more does very little, but as you approach character max, it increases. If, by changing equipment around, you can get over 600 hp, thats worth very much because it basically gets you out of 1-hit country. So +1 to what Pete said.
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Old April 22, 2019, 04:36   #42
Estie
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One more thing: make use of that new book. Make your own staircase down to below 90, only stopping if a really good opportunity presents itself. You can stairdance between 97 and 98, collecting floor items and killing small fry that drops items like small dragons and ghouls. The stuff that drops there is exceptionally better - experience potions, mithril arrows, scrolls of mass banishment, youll be ready for endgame in no time.

And for that purpose, stealth is superior.
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Old April 22, 2019, 09:09   #43
wizard44
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Thanks again for the tips everyone. Duntir has made accomplished the proposed goal in the previous part with flying colors, and has collected enough speed items to get to more than +30 on demand. So with that, I bring you:

Complete N00b's Journey: Part 5-9

I was convinced about switching for the Studded Leather Armor of Elvenkind and put it back for this dive in order to get my stealth to Heroic level. I then recalled back to D:65, found nothing of note nearby, and quickly descended to D:66, where I decide to play the roulette and quaff a potion of Toughness, which thankfully deducts my wisdom for the Constitution boost. Funnilly enough, I also find a potion of Wisdom to get back my lost wisdom. I also find an Amulet of Weaponmastery (+4, +3) <+3 STR> before I descend to D:67, where running into the cat lord forces me to teleport and escape in a newly created staircase that I build to D:68. On D:68, I find and quaff-id a Potion of Experience, althought it does not take me to level 34. Nothing else was found except a scroll of *Enchant Weapon*, which I put towards my arrows to little effect, as they only gained +1 to hit and nothing else. On D:69, I find two Potions of Wisdom and drink them, wishing they were potions of Strength before I find the staircase and descend. D:70 had a spare Rod of Teleport Other, which I enthusiastically take before heading to D:71. It is there that I take out Akhorail the Blind, who drops nothing of note to make up for the loss of arrows that I spent wasting on this guy. I do get to level 34 from the kill though. I also find the Resistances of Scarabtrices on the level, which provides me with much needed temporary resistance spells and proceed to D:72, where I finally waste Khim, Son of Mim, who drops a Caestus of Free Action (+0, +3) [5, +10]. I also find the Lance of the Eorlingas (3d8) (+13, +21) <+2 STR, +2 DEX, +2 speed>, which could be a decent weapon if I was to find more strength. D:73 had virtually nothing nearby, so I quickly descended to D:74, where an acid dragon room spilled out and threatened to overwhelm me, prompting me to teleport away and get to D:75, pronto. D:75 had a vault that contained Harowen, the Black Hand and Ungoliant the Unlight, both of which I teleport away to explore the vault. The vault contained a Potion that was a Potion of Life when quaff-id'd, a Long Bow of Extra Might (x4) (+24, +15) <+1>, and a Potion of *Enlightenment* that allowed me to find the presence of two Potions of Healing, which I use when I get cornered by a group of chaos hounds, a Potion of *Healing*, and a Potion of Experience, which I quaff. I then create a staircase to D:76 and descend, where I *finally* find and quaff a Potion of Strength. I then proceed to D:77, where I find 24 desperately needed Arrows (+6, +3) and descend to D:78, where I find a stack of mithril arrows and kill the Balrog of Moria to get to level 35, who drops the ring of fire 'Narya' (+2, +2) <+1 all> <+5 speed>, filling my pack to bursting. After killing a Dracolich, I then decide to Recall back to deposit my items and refill on my consumables.

Since right now, I have access to over +30 speed if temporary speed boosts are included, I think the plan is to get to D:98 and collect the following in preparation for the final battles:

10 Potions of *Healing* (So I should get at least 4 more than what I have)
3 Potions of Life
5 Scrolls of Mass Banishment
4 Scrolls of *Destruction*

I also plan to get to level 40 before taking on Sauron before the final battle since I really need the extra shot ability granted at that level.
I do not think I accomplish any of the above goals in this run, since we’re talking about covering 20 dungeon levels that I might potentially stop to collect items along the way. But I think I'm pretty confident that this character can do it PROVIDED I DO NOT SCREW THIS UP. Once I get to D:98, I will stairdance like hell and hope that I don'€™t get instagibbed by any of the uniques that I run into.

The ladder has been updated with Duntir'€™s status, and any input to refine this strategy is welcome.

Last edited by wizard44; April 22, 2019 at 22:17.
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Old April 22, 2019, 11:07   #44
Adam
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Narya grants telepathy so you can switch to Holhenneth for pConf + pBlind (you lose 1 INT but it's worth). It also gives iFire so no need for extra copies of the books.
As others said your biggest weakness is CON, too many monsters can instakill you. Besides a CON ring, also dwarven shields or one of the artifact shields Thorin/Elros/Haradrim would help (it's pretty unusual that you still use a simple "good" shield).
Potions of Life are rare, so I would not make it a goal to accumulate x of them. If you find them it's nice, but if not, don't worry.
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Old April 22, 2019, 11:36   #45
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I've never used life in the final fight. Those few !life take a slot that could fit multiple !heal or !*heal so there's an argument for hoarding !heal and carrying !life for emergencies.
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Old April 22, 2019, 12:49   #46
fph
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Originally Posted by wobbly View Post
I've never used life in the final fight. Those few !life take a slot that could fit multiple !heal or !*heal so there's an argument for hoarding !heal and carrying !life for emergencies.
From what I understand the main difference is that !life restores stats as well. How do you usually deal with stat restoration during the final fight? Do you use a slot for mushrooms of vigor? Rods of restoration? Do you only fight M when you have all stats sustained?
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Old April 22, 2019, 13:12   #47
Adam
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From what I understand the main difference is that !life restores stats as well. How do you usually deal with stat restoration during the final fight? Do you use a slot for mushrooms of vigor? Rods of restoration? Do you only fight M when you have all stats sustained?
I prefer mushrooms of vigor because it's easier to gather a meaningful number of them (and they don't break to cold/shards attacks). I find max 2-3 !life during a game, even augmentation is easier to collect. Rods of restoration I almost always drop immediately.
Sustain is also not rare, just in this thread @ has STR + CON sustained by Narya and DEX by trickery. And it matters only if you plan to melee M anyway.
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Old April 22, 2019, 13:44   #48
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Yeah for melee I want at least at least str/con/dex. My last priest used OOD and it didn't matter. For a ranger it usually doesn't matter. I'm usually low enough level to TO Morgoth away and level up if I really get caught out.
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Old April 22, 2019, 15:19   #49
Pete Mack
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You need better CON. Fast. Speed 24 doesn't help you much at this point, with such lousy HP. You cant possibly kill any monsters with speed 20 or above anyway.

Replace that speed ring with a ring of CON. I am amazed you haven't found one of at least +4 yet.
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Old April 22, 2019, 15:44   #50
Estie
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This is the point where you feel powerful, but you are still very vulnerable due to your low hit points. It is a dangerous time.

At that depth, teleportation is not safe. It can easily land you in a situation where you die before you can react. If you get into trouble and have to leave this instance, use ?teleport level. (Also, collect ?*destruction* when you find them). If you have more than one turn, use _*destruction*. There is another spell of interest in Mord´s - create doors allows you to block LOS on demand.

You next goal is to accumulate a setup that includes enough constitution to survive any of the big 1-hit attacks.
Untill you can do that, stay stealthy and low profile. Now your spear is the best choice not because of its speed, but because of its stealth bonus. That said, look out for weapons with a con bonus. Two points of con can make enough difference for you to want to swap later.

Going from 350 to 450 hps is not worth losing speed and stealth for - 600 is.
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