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Old March 14, 2010, 19:54   #1
Mushuukyou
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How does this compare to ZangbandTK?

Is there a big difference?
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Old March 14, 2010, 20:41   #2
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What is "this"? Are you talking about Vanilla in general? Vanilla is the base game from which all other Angband variants derive. Since most variants simply add a bunch of new stuff, Vanilla is simpler and more streamlined -- fewer races, fewer classes, fewer monsters, and generally better balance. However, Vanilla's also gotten way more advances in UI than most variants have.
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Old March 14, 2010, 21:11   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Derakon View Post
What is "this"? Are you talking about Vanilla in general? Vanilla is the base game from which all other Angband variants derive. Since most variants simply add a bunch of new stuff, Vanilla is simpler and more streamlined -- fewer races, fewer classes, fewer monsters, and generally better balance. However, Vanilla's also gotten way more advances in UI than most variants have.
Have you played ZangbandTK? Do you feel the Vanilla option is more advanced in some ways?
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Old March 15, 2010, 02:00   #4
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I have not played ZangbandTk, but it's my understanding that the *Tk games are basically prettier versions of their base games. Thus, ZangbandTk is a prettier version of Zangband, which split off from the Vanilla codebase ages ago. They're going to be pretty different games; I can't simply rank them and say "this game is more advanced than this other game."

I suggest you just download Vanilla and give it a shot.
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Old March 15, 2010, 07:21   #5
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For playing Zangband (and not Z+angband), ZTk is undoubtedly the superior choice given the huge improvements to UI, including squelch which aren't available under other versions.

If you're playing the "Vanilla Town" option under ZangTk, it is light-years away from current Vanilla Angband, since it's still a variant and not vanilla, the only real difference that comes from that option is the lack of wilderness and quests.

There is, however AngbandTk (I don't remember which version... 2.9.3, maybe?). The game has changed a whole lot since then. All these versions have their merits, but the most modern is current vanilla, if you can part with the pretty-windows UI of Tk. Other UI elements are vastly improved.
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Old March 15, 2010, 07:42   #6
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What UI elements are vastly improved since ZTK?

Couldn't they have taken everything in ZTK and just added/changed to it to bring vanilla up to speed?
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Old March 15, 2010, 08:19   #7
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I think you are missing the point. ZTK is a port of vanilla Angband. Vanilla doesn't go swimming around in source ports for updates. If it did, we'd have sherbet vanilla Angband. While it may taste good, it'd effectively source port itself, and that's a step away from dividing by zero.
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Old March 15, 2010, 08:35   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flechette View Post
I think you are missing the point. ZTK is a port of vanilla Angband. Vanilla doesn't go swimming around in source ports for updates. If it did, we'd have sherbet vanilla Angband. While it may taste good, it'd effectively source port itself, and that's a step away from dividing by zero.
Not sure I get it.

Ok, so Angband doesn't aspire to have all that ZTK does? Or it does, but it needs to be written their way?

I'm not sure what you mean by "source port itself".
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Old March 15, 2010, 13:02   #9
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It's like ice cream. You start with Vanilla. If you want chocolate ice cream, you add chocolate (more or less). What you don't do is take the chocolate ice cream and try to remove the chocolate to get vanilla, even if the chocolate ice cream tastes better (in your opinion). You have to go back to the basic vanilla and make the improvements you want without turning it into chocolate. If you're disciplined, you'll end up with a better vanilla and if your not you'll get 'french vanilla' or 'vanilla chocolate chip'.

Think of vanilla as 'traditional' Angband. Changes have been made and are still being made that make the game better without changing the core of the game.
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Old March 15, 2010, 13:52   #10
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Ok, I think I get it... but, isn't it kinda... gray?

I mean... the minimap would be great to have like what they have in ZTK... so maybe *maybe* vanilla will do it like that? ... but then, we have all of these outside areas unlike vanilla's town... sooo... do they draw the line there? No outside areas? Or.. maybe they will, but make it optional? ... I mean... how does one determine what's vanilla and what's added extra stuff that won't be preferred by the vanilla lovin people?

I'm just trying to understand here.. not tryin' to be a pest.
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