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Old December 10, 2018, 09:19   #31
wobbly
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There's also shooters which will take down anything without a ranged option as long as you have enough phases in the bank & a way to illuminate the area around you.
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Old December 10, 2018, 09:54   #32
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"At DL20 first invis monsters show up, so it is almost a must have to have SeeInvis from DL 20 on."
Especially with a mage I don't care much about SI. If it comes, nice, if not, no problem (at least I don't grind for that). Detect Invisible is usually no problem to have already at low levels. Yes, it sucks since you see them only for one turn but it's enough help to avoid them. The first really dangerous ones are dreads below DL30 anyway where you are probably also able to cast Reveal Monsters.
In my current game SI came first at DL38 but I had no problem, just 2-3 annoying situations (drained wisdom/xp, lost food).
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Old December 10, 2018, 20:09   #33
Tibarius
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Wand of Magic Missile

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Originally Posted by Pete Mack View Post
The bit about CL3 is simply wrong. There are flasks of oil and buffing potions. And there are wands of magic missile. If you can survive until DL 5, in principle you can get Bullroarer at CL 1, with either of those options, plus some scrolls of phase door. Yes, you would have to be lucky. But the main point stands: if you don't rely on lousy spell damage, you can advance to CL 5 much, much faster.
Does your comment give any further insight into power diving for the original person asking?

Where does this Wand of Magic Missle come from, paid for with starting gold?
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Old December 10, 2018, 20:11   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wobbly View Post
There's also shooters which will take down anything without a ranged option as long as you have enough phases in the bank & a way to illuminate the area around you.
Does your comment give any further insight into power diving for the original person asking?

Where does this Shooter come from, paid for with starting gold?
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Old December 10, 2018, 21:37   #35
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You can afford a Wand of Magic Missile with your starting money, yes. You can more easily afford a sling and some iron shots, though they're heavier, deal less damage, and are less reliable. Of course this means sacrificing in other areas -- fewer Phase Door, no Word of Recall, etc. If you're playing a diving strategy, you should be prepared to commit to it, which includes being prepared to basically ironman the first 10+ dungeon levels. Maybe you don't find critical supplies, and maybe you die because of it, but you're only out 15 minutes so it doesn't much matter.
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Old December 10, 2018, 21:37   #36
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Yes, paid for with starting gold. I generally buy a dozen flasks of oil and heroism if I am playing a weak character (with less than 3 blows.) No, it doesn't always pay off. But when it does, it is a big, big win, at cost 80.
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Old December 10, 2018, 23:24   #37
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I think the idea of getting to CL3 as quickly as possible was to get the detect spells (monsters and stairs) to enable the decision whether to dive down, fight a monster, or to scum up and down the stairs.

What's not explained is what type of monsters are considered big XP monsters? Are you looking for high experience along with safety and go for monsters that don't do a lot of damage? Or do you look for OoD monsters that will pay more but are also more risky based on the damage they do? I imagine that the latter is good if you have the mana to attack and phase door when they get close enough to melee but monsters like orcs and trolls tend to show up in groups making that strategy harder. Also, do you take the likelihood of a drop into account? Nearby jellies/molds/eyes are all probably safe and provide free XP (although not a lot) but also don't drop anything.
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Old December 11, 2018, 00:15   #38
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There is a progression. Roughly:
Fang/Grip
Dark elf, kobold mage, kobold archer
Bullroarer (really)
Wolves
Trolls and orcs using rods/wands of light and lightning bolt
Pack or two of weak hounds
Young dragons
Adult dragons
Weaker greater demons
There are others, but these stand out.
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Old December 11, 2018, 11:52   #39
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high XP monsters

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete Mack View Post
There is a progression. Roughly:
Fang/Grip
Dark elf, kobold mage, kobold archer
Bullroarer (really)
Wolves
Trolls and orcs using rods/wands of light and lightning bolt
Pack or two of weak hounds
Young dragons
Adult dragons
Weaker greater demons
There are others, but these stand out.
That was indeed helpfull for any new player! +1 from me for that post.

For the starting levels Frost Bolt will shatter: R Frogs, n Nagas and J SNakes (usually one hit kills).

I might specify the demons:
U Vrocks

And then at the top end the stationary monsters you can kill with Acid Bolt alone giving 20K XP still at high levels
Master Qs
Drujis - can not recal their character right now

And if you got Fire or Cold immunity you can take GreatWyrms of that element.

Dreadlords give 30K XP and have no considerable hard attack either.
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