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Old May 1, 2011, 17:09   #21
Mikko Lehtinen
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Windows compile

I finally managed to build a Windows compile that works!

On Vista or Windows 7 you may need to change the font before you can see anything. I've tested this on Windows 2000, Windows 7 and Wine. Please report whether this works on Vista!

(Since I now have a true Windows compile, I removed the DOS build.)

I used Nick's modified fonts, and edited font-win.prf to target the new glyphs.
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Old May 2, 2011, 22:55   #22
jevansau
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Firstly, thanks for re-invigorating one of my favorite variants. For me the Windows build worked straight away on Windows 7.
The new features are certainly interesting, and so far, the characters I've tried have played very differently - a Felpurr rogue, an Ursa Shaman and a Vargyr mage.
With the Ursa, I was only getting about 1 up stairs every 4 levels, the rogue always and the mage mostly.
I have found a few minor issues:
Because of the fire/frost division, only the first 3 (fire) or 2 (frost) spellbooks are available in the bookshop.
The mushroom description for a Shaman should show the appropriate effects to avoid the need for notes.
Powders should show their effect.
You can get odd error messages aiming a wand of wonder into unknown grid locations. Unfortunately I didn't note the details of this.
Even with weapons and armor pre-identified, identify seems in very short supply. Perhaps bigger stacks could be generated in the bookshop.
There is no adventurers guild in town - just a building with no door - not sure if this is intentional or not.

Still, for a first release this is very polished. Thanks for your fine efforts.

Regards,
Jonathan
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Old May 3, 2011, 08:56   #23
Mikko Lehtinen
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Jonathan, thanks for the valuable comments!

I'll look at the issues some time later, when I don't have a tight deadline hanging over me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jevansau View Post
Even with weapons and armor pre-identified, identify seems in very short supply. Perhaps bigger stacks could be generated in the bookshop.
Myself, I've learned to live with this short supply. For me it creates an interesting mini game. Of course tastes vary, and I'll consider increasing the stack size.

You can't sell scrolls or potions to the shops for identification anymore, but you can buy one of each of their cheaper offerings, just to gain knowledge.

If I have a Scroll of Remove Curse, I often identify rings and amulets by putting them on, and wait for the ID to kick in. (This is now quite fast for all the classes.)

Reading, drinking and eating un-id:d stuff is not that bad after you have managed to identify the worst surprises.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jevansau View Post
There is no adventurers guild in town - just a building with no door - not sure if this is intentional or not.
This is intentional. Unfortunately Adventurer's Guild didn't fit in my vision. I couldn't find a clean way to remove the building, so I just removed the door.

I'm considering adding a new building to replace Adventurer's Guild.
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Old May 3, 2011, 19:14   #24
Arendil
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Ingame mesage:

"Only rogues can sell items."

I can't really play without selling items. Could you add an option to enable selling for everyone? Thanks.

Otherwise, variant looks cool.

Cheers.
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Old May 3, 2011, 19:16   #25
Derakon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arendil View Post
I can't really play without selling items.
Have you tried? I mean, made a decent effort with a couple of characters?
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Old May 3, 2011, 19:40   #26
Arendil
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Derakon
Have you tried? I mean, made a decent effort with a couple of characters?
What for? I know what's fun for me. Such restrictions can only make me play something else. I don't want to start offtopic discussion here, but I really don't understand what's the point of limiting choices in games.
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Old May 3, 2011, 19:45   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arendil View Post
What for? I know what's fun for me. Such restrictions can only make me play something else. I don't want to start offtopic discussion here, but I really don't understand what's the point of limiting choices in games.
Because I've seen a consistent pattern among many players here of initially disliking the idea of playing without selling, only to discover once they've tried it that it's an improvement to the game. Just check out this thread.

Now, there are some people who have tried it and still don't like it; you might well be one of those. But I really strongly suggest that you try it before discounting it, so at least you are making an informed decision.
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Old May 3, 2011, 20:05   #28
Arendil
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Derakon
Now, there are some people who have tried it and still don't like it; you might well be one of those. But I really strongly suggest that you try it before discounting it, so at least you are making an informed decision.
First of all, I play Crawl occasionaly, so I know what I'm talking about.

Second of all, I strongly suggest you to stop that silly "holy -no selling- grail crusade".
Game with more options, more things to do is always far superior then the one with less choices. End of story. You can play normal game without selling if you like, I can't play with selling if it's disabled. I can't really find any decent arguments for disabling some features, and honestly, I'm sadly quite dissapointed in community.

Sorry for harsh words, but are you adults or children? Can you restrict yourself, or do you always do everything you can, no matter how stupid or fun ruining for you it may be? Do you really need some hard-coded restrictions to prevent you from doing some actions? Is that really that neccesary?

But that's certainly not the place for this offtopic discussion, so I'll stop here.
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Old May 3, 2011, 20:07   #29
Mikko Lehtinen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arendil View Post
Ingame mesage:

"Only rogues can sell items."

I can't really play without selling items. Could you add an option to enable selling for everyone? Thanks.
You can edit p_class.txt and add APPRAISE flag to all classes. Like this:

F:PSEUDO_ID4 | PSEUDO_ID_HEAVY | TRAP_KNOW | APPRAISE |
F:AMBUSH | BETTER_THROW

APPRAISE enables the class to appraise and sell items. However, characters can still only sell *expensive* items. Item's evaluated price -- (I)nspect the item to check it out -- must be at least your minimum depth in feet.

Would this do as a compromise between no-selling and selling? The gameplay is much faster, as you don't have to collect everything for selling.
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Old May 3, 2011, 20:18   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arendil View Post
First of all, I play Crawl occasionaly, so I know what I'm talking about.

Second of all, I strongly suggest you to stop that silly "holy -no selling- grail crusade".
Yikes, I wasn't trying to be confrontational here, but evidently I've struck a nerve. Apologies; I hadn't realized this was a sore spot for you. That said, I'd appreciate it if you were as polite to me as I am polite to you. If you think I'm belaboring a point, then say so; needless vitriol just makes things dirty.

I still think you should try the no-selling approach first before you decide it's not for you, just like I'd recommend trying e.g. Ironman before deciding that ironman games aren't your style. I'm not clear on how having played Crawl is germaine to the discussion (speaking as someone who hasn't played Crawl), but Angband is a different game than Crawl; how much does your experience with one game transfer to your experience with another?
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