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Old January 30, 2009, 06:09   #1
Wraitheist
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Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 133
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Help with Morgoth

Hey Guys,

So I finally went and killed Sauron for the first time (woot!). It wasn't too bad, I used maybe 4 !healing and a ?banish. So I went right down after Morgoth and it didn't go very well. I only took down about 2 *s before I ran out of !healing and he or one of his summons must have destroyed all of my 20+ cure critical wounds. I also used my only 3 mass banishments. Obviously, I'm not doing something right.

1) First, should I be digging a certain kind of tunnel? I dug an anti-summoning corridor and I guess it helped, but since he burrows, there was plenty of room for him to summon uniques.

2) Should I pelt him with bolts from afar or try to melee him as a rogue? He was frequently nailing me with something that took away 700+ hps.

3) What consumables should I have? How many !healing and such? How about ?Mass Banishment?



Finally, here is my character. Any equipment I should switch out? Right now, I basically have all of my resists covered out of paranoia, but perhaps I could squeeze more damage but getting rid of uneeded resists. Thanks!

Code:
  [Angband 3.1.0 beta Character Dump]

 Sex    Male         Age            113   Str:  18/99  +1  +2 +13 18/*** 18/***
 Race   High-Elf     Height          87   INT! 18/100  +3  +1  +3 18/170
 Class  Rogue        Weight         201   WIS:  18/85  -1  -2 +15 18/205
 Title  Master Thief Social      Lordly   DEX! 18/100  +3  +3  +8 18/***
 HP     1008/1008    Maximize         Y   CON! 18/100  +1  +1 +11 18/***
 SP     114/322                           CHR:  18/99  +5  -1 +10 18/***


 Level               47   Armor   [28,+115]     Saving Throw        100%
 Cur Exp        7838107   Fight   (+58,+38)     Stealth           Superb
 Max Exp        7838107   Melee   (+77,+59)     Fighting       Legendary
 Adv Exp        7875000   Shoot   (+68,+14)     Shooting       Legendary
 MaxDepth  5000' (L100)   Blows      5/turn     Disarming           100%
 Turns           828006   Shots      1/turn     Magic Device   Legendary
 Gold           1114254   Infra       70 ft     Perception       1 in 12
 Burden       175.7 lbs   Speed          28     Searching            35%

 You are the only child of a Telerin Warrior.  You have light grey
 eyes, wavy black hair, and a fair complexion.



 Acid:+.....+++.... Confu:.........+.+.
 Elec:+.*...+++.... Sound:.........+...
 Fire:++....++.+... Shard:......+......
 Cold:+.....++.+... Nexus:+.....+......
 Pois:..+....+..... Nethr:...........+.
 Fear:+...+........ Chaos:.........+.+.
 Lite:.....+...+..+ Disen:........+....
 Dark:..+..+..+.... S.Dig:..+..........
Blind:.........+... Feath:..+..........

PLite:....+...++... Aggrv:.............
Regen:..+.+....+... Stea.:.............
Telep:..+.......... Sear.:.............
Invis:+.+.++...+..+ Infra:....+.......+
FrAct:+.+.+.....++. Tunn.:+............
HLife:..+..+....... Speed:.+++.....+...
ImpHP:............. Blows:.............
ImpSP:............. Shots:.............
 Fear:............. Might:.............


  [Character Equipment]

a) The Great Hammer of Aule (9d3) (+19,+21) [+5] (+4)
     +4 wisdom, tunneling.
     Provides resistance to acid, lightning, fire, cold, fear, nexus.
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
     Prevents paralysis.
     Grants the ability to see invisible things.
     With this weapon, you would currently get 5 blows per round.  Each
     blow will do an average damage of 95 against evil creatures, 113
     against demons, 113 against undead, 113 against acid-vulnerable
     creatures, 149 against dragons, and 77 against normal creatures.
b) The Light Crossbow 'Cubragol' (x3) (+10,+14) (+10) {excellent}
     +10 speed.
     Provides resistance to fire.
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
c) The Ring of Power 'Vilya' (+10,+10) (+3)
     +3 strength, intelligence, wisdom, dexterity, constitution, 
     charisma, speed.
     Provides immunity to lightning.
     Provides resistance to lightning, poison, dark.
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
     Sustains intelligence, dexterity, constitution.
     Slows your metabolism.
     Feather Falling.
     Speeds regeneration.
     Prevents paralysis.
     Stops experience drain.
     Grants telepathy.
     Grants the ability to see invisible things.
     When activated, it heals 1000 hit points.
     It takes 200 turns to recharge after use.
d) a Sapphire Ring of Speed (+12)
     +12 speed.
e) The Necklace of the Dwarves (+3)
     +3 strength, constitution, infravision.
     Provides resistance to fear.
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
     Speeds regeneration.
     Prevents paralysis.
     Grants the ability to see invisible things.
     Radius 1 light.
f) The Arkenstone of Thrain
     Provides resistance to light, dark.
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
     Stops experience drain.
     Grants the ability to see invisible things.
     When activated, it detects treasure, objects, traps, doors, stairs, 
     e3 light.
g) The Chain Mail of Arvedui (-2) [14,+15] (+2)
     +2 strength, charisma.
     Provides resistance to acid, lightning, fire, cold, shards, nexus.
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
h) The Cloak 'Colluin' [1,+15]
     Provides resistance to acid, lightning, fire, cold, poison.
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
     When activated, it grants temporary resistance to acid, electricit
     y, fire, cold and poison for 1d20+20 turns.
     It takes 111 turns to recharge after use.
i) The Mithril Shield of Gil-galad [10,+20] (+5)
     +5 wisdom, charisma.
     Provides resistance to acid, lightning, dark, disenchantment.
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
     Sustains wisdom, dexterity, charisma.
     When activated, it fires a line of light in all directions, each o
     ne causing 10d8 damage.
     It takes 100 turns to recharge after use.
     Radius 1 light.
j) The Golden Crown of Gondor [0,+15] (+3)
     +3 strength, wisdom, constitution, speed.
     Provides resistance to fire, cold, light, blindness, confusion, 
     sound, chaos.
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
     Speeds regeneration.
     Grants the ability to see invisible things.
     When activated, it heals 500 hit points.
     It takes 250 turns to recharge after use.
     Radius 1 light.
k) The Set of Leather Gloves 'Cambeleg' (+8,+8) [1,+15] (+2)
     +2 strength, constitution.
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
     Prevents paralysis.
l) The Pair of Leather Boots 'Dal-i-thalion' [2,+15] (+5)
     +5 dexterity.
     Provides resistance to confusion, nether, chaos.
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
     Sustains constitution.
     Prevents paralysis.
     When activated, it cures you of fear and poison.
     It takes 5 turns to recharge after use.


  [Character Inventory]

a) 2 Books of Magic Spells [Magic for Beginners] {@1}
b) 4 Books of Magic Spells [Incantations and Illusions] {@3}
c) 3 Books of Magic Spells [Sorcery and Evocations] {@4}
d) 3 Books of Magic Spells [Resistances of Scarabtarices] {@5}
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
e) 2 Books of Magic Spells [Mordenkainen's Escapes] {@6}
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
f) 2 Books of Magic Spells [Tenser's Transformations] {@7}
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
g) 38 Scrolls titled "ula tatia" of Phase Door
h) 4 Copper Rods of Magic Mapping (1 charging)
i) 7 Gold Wands of Teleport Other (0 charges)
j) an Ironwood Staff of *Destruction* (0 charges)
k) a Teak Staff of Banishment (0 charges)
l) The Amulet of Ingwe (+3) (charging)
     +3 intelligence, wisdom, charisma, infravision.
     Provides resistance to acid, lightning, cold.
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
     Prevents paralysis.
     Grants the ability to see invisible things.
     When activated, it deals five times your level's damage to all evi
     l creatures that you can see.
     It takes 50 turns to recharge after use.
m) 26 Bolts of Wounding (1d5) (+15,+23)
     Fired from your current missile launcher, this arrow will hit targets
     up to 120 feet away, inflicting an average damage of 360 against
     fire-vulnerable creatures, and 120 against normal creatures.
     25% chance of breaking upon contact.
n) 22 Bolts of Slay Demon (1d5) (+16,+14)
     Fired from your current missile launcher, this arrow will hit targets
     up to 120 feet away, inflicting an average damage of 279 against
     demons, 279 against fire-vulnerable creatures, and 93 against
     normal creatures.
     25% chance of breaking upon contact.
o) 21 Bolts of Acid (1d5) (+10,+14)
     Cannot be harmed by acid.
     Fired from your current missile launcher, this arrow will hit targets
     up to 120 feet away, inflicting an average damage of 279 against
     acid-vulnerable creatures, 279 against fire-vulnerable creatures, 
     and 93 against normal creatures.
     25% chance of breaking upon contact.
p) 20 Mithril Bolts of Slay Undead (3d5) (+17,+14)
     Cannot be harmed by acid, fire.
     Fired from your current missile launcher, this arrow will hit targets
     up to 120 feet away, inflicting an average damage of 333 against
     undead, 333 against fire-vulnerable creatures, and 111 against
     normal creatures.
     25% chance of breaking upon contact.


  [Home Inventory]

a) a Grey Speckled Potion of Life
     When ingested, it restores 5000 hit points, restores experience an
     d stats, heals cut damage, and cures stunning, poison, blindness, 
     and confusion.
     It can be thrown at creatures with damaging effect.
b) a Bloodstone Ring of Acid [+15]
     Provides resistance to acid.
     Cannot be harmed by acid.
     
     When activated, it grants acid resistance for d20+20 turns and cre
     ates an acid ball of damage 70.
     It takes d50+50 turns to recharge after use.
c) The Ring of Barahir (+1)
     +1 strength, intelligence, wisdom, dexterity, constitution, 
     charisma, stealth.
     Provides resistance to poison, dark.
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
     
d) The Ring of Power 'Nenya' (+8,+8) (+2)
     +2 strength, intelligence, wisdom, dexterity, constitution, 
     charisma, speed.
     Provides immunity to cold.
     Provides resistance to cold, blindness.
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
     Sustains intelligence, wisdom, constitution.
     Feather Falling.
     Speeds regeneration.
     Prevents paralysis.
     Stops experience drain.
     Grants telepathy.
     Grants the ability to see invisible things.
     
     When activated, it restores your experience to full.
     It takes 200 turns to recharge after use.
e) The Elfstone 'Elessar' (+7,+7) [+10] (+2)
     +2 strength, wisdom, charisma, speed.
     Provides resistance to fire, poison, fear.
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
     
     When activated, it heals 500 hit points.
     It takes 200 turns to recharge after use.
f) The Jewel 'Evenstar'
     Provides resistance to cold, dark.
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
     Sustains intelligence, wisdom, constitution.
     Stops experience drain.
     
     When activated, it restores your experience to full.
     It takes 150 turns to recharge after use.
g) The Augmented Chain Mail of Caspanion (-2) [16,+20] (+3)
     +3 intelligence, wisdom, constitution.
     Provides resistance to acid, poison, confusion.
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
     
     When activated, it destroys all traps and doors surrounding you.
     It takes 10 turns to recharge after use.
h) The Metal Brigandine Armour of the Rohirrim [20,+15] (+2)
     +2 strength, dexterity.
     Provides resistance to acid, lightning, fire, cold, fear, 
     confusion, sound.
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
     
i) The Full Plate Armour of Isildur [26,+25] (+1)
     +1 constitution.
     Provides resistance to acid, lightning, fire, cold, confusion, 
     sound, nexus.
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
     
j) The Mithril Chain Mail 'Belegennon' (-1) [28,+20] (+4)
     +4 stealth.
     Provides resistance to acid, lightning, fire, cold, poison.
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
     
     When activated, it teleports you randomly up to 10 squares away.
     It takes 2 turns to recharge after use.
k) The Mithril Plate Mail of Celeborn (-3) [35,+25] (+4)
     +4 strength, charisma.
     Provides resistance to acid, lightning, fire, cold, dark, 
     disenchantment.
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
     
     When activated, it removes all non-unique monsters represented by 
     a chosen symbol from the level, dealing you damage in the process.
     It takes 500 turns to recharge after use.
l) The Hard Leather Armour of Himring [8,+15]
     Provides resistance to poison, nether, chaos.
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
     
     When activated, it grants you protection from evil for 1d25 plus 3 
     times your character level turns.
     It takes 100 turns to recharge after use.
m) The Cloak 'Colannon' [1,+15] (+3)
     +3 stealth, speed.
     Provides resistance to nexus.
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
     
     When activated, it teleports you randomly up to 100 squares away.
     It takes 45 turns to recharge after use.
n) The Small Metal Shield of Thorin [3,+25] (+4)
     +4 strength, constitution.
     Provides immunity to acid.
     Provides resistance to fear, sound, chaos.
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
     Prevents paralysis.
     
o) The Metal Cap of Celebrimbor [3,+18] (+3 searching)
     +3 intelligence, dexterity, charisma, searching.
     Provides resistance to acid, fire, shards, disenchantment.
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
     
p) The Iron Helm of Dor-Lomin [5,+20] (+4)
     +4 strength, dexterity, constitution.
     Provides resistance to acid, lightning, fire, cold, fear.
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
     Grants telepathy.
     Grants the ability to see invisible things.
     
     Radius 1 light.
q) The Iron Helm 'Holhenneth' [5,+10] (+2)
     +2 intelligence, wisdom, searching.
     Provides resistance to blindness, confusion.
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
     Grants the ability to see invisible things.
     
     When activated, it detects treasure, objects, traps, doors, stairs, r) a Pair of Mithril Shod Boots of Speed [7,+15] (+9)

     w+9 speed.
     Cannot be harmed by acid.
     
s) The Glaive of Pain (9d6) (+0,+30)
     Provides resistance to fear.
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
     
     With this weapon, you would currently get 5 blows per round.  Each
     blow will do an average damage of 99.5 against normal creatures.
t) The Long Bow 'Belthronding' (x3) (+20,+22) (+1)
     +1 dexterity, stealth, speed, shooting speed.
     Provides resistance to disenchantment.
     Cannot be harmed by acid, electricity, fire, cold.
     
u) 14 Bolts of Slay Evil (1d5) (+12,+17)
     Fired from your current missile launcher, this arrow will hit targets
     up to 120 feet away, inflicting an average damage of 204 against
     evil creatures, 306 against fire-vulnerable creatures, and 102
     against normal creatures.
     25% chance of breaking upon contact.


  [Options]

Maximize effect of race/class bonuses        : yes (adult_maximize)
Randomize some of the artifacts (beta)       : no  (adult_randarts)
Restrict the use of stairs/recall            : no  (adult_ironman)
Restrict the use of stores/home              : no  (adult_no_stores)
Restrict creation of artifacts               : no  (adult_no_artifacts)
Don't stack objects on the floor             : no  (adult_no_stacking)
Lose artifacts when leaving level            : no  (adult_no_preserve)
Don't generate connected stairs              : no  (adult_no_stairs)
Adult: Monsters chase current location       : yes (adult_ai_sound)
Adult: Monsters chase recent locations       : yes (adult_ai_smell)
Adult: Monsters act smarter in groups        : yes (adult_ai_packs)
Adult: Monsters learn from their mistakes    : no  (adult_ai_learn)
Adult: Monsters exploit players weaknesses   : no  (adult_ai_cheat)
Adult: Monsters behave more intelligently (broken): no  (adult_ai_smart)
Score: Peek into object creation             : no  (score_peek)
Score: Peek into monster creation            : no  (score_hear)
Score: Peek into dungeon creation            : no  (score_room)
Score: Peek into something else              : no  (score_xtra)
Score: Know complete monster info            : no  (score_know)
Score: Allow player to avoid death           : no  (score_live)
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Old January 30, 2009, 15:19   #2
Zikke
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Posts: 1,067
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My only (recent) win was with a warrior, so my experience is a little different, but


I waited until I had cold and fire immunity before fighting him so I didn't lose inventory items. He drains charges, but I knew that any scrolls, rods, or potions I had were completely safe. Depending on your speed, you could even keep a stack of ?Recharging and a _Healing if you think you can recharge and then heal without getting the charges drained that turn. It is a useful "endless healing" tool sometimes.

When I fought him, I had killed all but 2 uniques (which he didn't summon after all), so that helps.

I also tunneled into the corner of the map so I couldn't be surrounded. One of the sides was usually a wall after his earthquakes so it really reduced the damage I took.

I tried shooting Slay Evil ammo at him but it didn't do anything useful. I could do a ton more damage by melee'ing him, but that was with 6 blows/round with Eonwe.

And I resisted the urge to use up my ?banish'es unless the things summoned next to me were particularly nasty. If it was just a chromatic dragon or a regular Lich or something, I left him to take up space (was immune to cold, fire, lightning, and acid so I <3'ed dragons).

I recommend having at least 10 potions to heal you to full, whether Life, *Healing*, etc. It's really about the immunities and positioning yourself in a corner so you don't take as much damage. And get a couple rods of Speed so you can always be hastened and he can't drain the charges.
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Old January 30, 2009, 15:27   #3
Donald Jonker
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And keep your haste-self active.. After being inspired by Zikke's win, I took on Morgoth and ended up with a tombstone. I'm pretty sure what happened was my haste-self ran out, my speed dipped to +25 and I got double mana-stormed. My immunity equipment was also very similar to Zikke's, so can't help you with the consumable destruction blues.
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Old January 30, 2009, 16:04   #4
Zikke
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Aw I'm sorry Donald. Didn't mean to steer you into a tree. RNG I guess...
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Old January 30, 2009, 16:05   #5
tigpup
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zikke View Post
Depending on your speed, you could even keep a stack of ?Recharging and a _Healing if you think you can recharge and then heal without getting the charges drained that turn. It is a useful "endless healing" tool sometimes.
.
In NPP, I sometimes drop _Heal on floor and use it from there when facing M. No charges can get drained if it's on the floor. I think this is the same in V.

Once M destructs an area, a phase/heal/wait approach can be quite useful. There's usually enough rubble to hide behind to keep you safe for a turn or two to heal. This often also gives a useful LOS to tele_away other monsters before M gets an attack in again.

But then again, I haven't been near M in V for about 3 years, so probably best to ignore everything I have to say (NPP M has limited mana, which probably makes the last battle a little different)

-Neil.
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Old January 30, 2009, 16:29   #6
Donald Jonker
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zikke View Post
Aw I'm sorry Donald. Didn't mean to steer you into a tree. RNG I guess...
Heh no worries. It's refreshing to lose a final boss fight and have it actually mean something. It's also possible that it had something to do with a lack of ?massBanish (so as not to completely derail the thread, Wraitheist - I recommend you stock some for when you get surrounded by L's since you lack immunities).

Better anyway to die from inattentiveness whilst fighting Morgoth than die from inattentiveness whilst fighting the Terrasque - which is what convinced me to take the final plunge more than anything else.
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Old January 30, 2009, 17:59   #7
Dragonboneman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wraitheist View Post
must have destroyed all of my 20+ cure critical wounds.
I never bother with CCW against Morgoth due to the heavy damage he inflicts. However I stockpile everything better than !Healing for the entire game, along with scrolls of (Mass) Banishment.

Quote:
1) First, should I be digging a certain kind of tunnel? I dug an anti-summoning corridor and I guess it helped, but since he burrows, there was plenty of room for him to summon uniques.
I don't dig ASCs, instead relying on Morgoth's destruction effect in melee.

Quote:
2) Should I pelt him with bolts from afar or try to melee him as a rogue? He was frequently nailing me with something that took away 700+ hps.
With your setup, I'd focus on melee. Beware Morgy's stat drain if you're lacking any sustains.

Quote:
3) What consumables should I have? How many !healing and such? How about ?Mass Banishment?
Lots. It's hard to give a clear answer to this as there are so many variables. Ten potions sounds a bit low, if I think back to the time I killed Morgoth with a Kobold Rogue, though I once managed to beat him without using any potions at all. That was a HE Ranger + Bard + Seeker Arrows of Holy Might combo though.

Others have already posted a lot of good advice, and I've thrown in my tuppenceworth too. Good luck!
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Old January 30, 2009, 22:43   #8
Pete Mack
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You need to stock up on the various !healing potions--it's useful to keep them from the start, so that you have plenty when the time comes. Also, you need a few (maybe 6) !rMana.

It's really good to have Rods of Teleport Other. The wands get sucked dry in melee with M. With Vilya, you don't have to worry about losing them to electricity; ordinarily, stay away from electricity breathers & melee to preserve them.

And don't worry so much about less important resistance holes. AC is more important vs Morgoth than any of rShards, rNexus, rLight, etc. Instead, use Celeborn to get one free Banishment activation.

Thorin might be better than Gil-Galad for the acid immunity and extra strength, since you don't have a sustain.

Also: use Nenya and Elessar for additional damage. Recover some of the lost speed with Colannon. +23 speed is fine for taking on M; an addition 60 dam/turn is worth giving up a few points of speed. Colluin's activation isn't useful for a high level Rogue.
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Old January 30, 2009, 22:49   #9
Donald Jonker
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dragonboneman View Post
I never bother with CCW against Morgoth due to the heavy damage he inflicts.
!CCW are a bit more useful nowadays since they heal a percentage of HP and can keep you above a safe threshold. They're also good for chugging when you teleport away and are waiting for M to come back and find you, if you're economizing !healing.
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Old January 30, 2009, 23:52   #10
Dragonboneman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Donald Jonker View Post
!CCW are a bit more useful nowadays since they heal a percentage of HP and can keep you above a safe threshold. They're also good for chugging when you teleport away and are waiting for M to come back and find you, if you're economizing !healing.
Not having yet put much into the current version I didn't know that. Thanks.
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