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Old February 2, 2020, 14:16   #11
Aszazin
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Because it feels like I got stuck, I started a 2nd game, but there is no shop "4" or "5" (so there is little chance I will obtain words of recall and other potions & scrolls.
(There are 3 black markets, in the other game, there wasn't a black market).

Is it meant like that?
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Old February 2, 2020, 15:51   #12
Aszazin
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I just encountered a crash. the game was gone. Opening the savegame threw me back at start level 1. I accidentally pushed a wrong button (s or d) in the dungeon after another command, but it all went so fast. It is difficult to say what exactly happened.

(sorry for the spray of reports, I really like Cthangband like it is now, and I happen to have some time for a long playing session today.)
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Old February 2, 2020, 16:54   #13
Aszazin
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I just found a possible imperfection. I just picked up a bronze rod, and used it to check what it does. It detects traps clearly, as it shows a Dtrap below and marks the area. But the rod wasn't recognized.
After identifying it is a rod of trap location, which I of course already expected.
Possibly this is by design? (don't know if there's also a rod which detects traps and more).

I never encountered this way of trap detection, where there is a visible indication of the detection and the (annoying) "you are about to leave a trap detected zone" followed by a "you just left a trap detected zone" which I know from other variants. It is the best system so far, in my opinion.
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Old February 2, 2020, 19:35   #14
Pete Mack
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Yes, it is common to many variants--a green border around the safe area, and a warning when you cross it. A few versions of V have it, from before the trap machanic was changed.
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Old February 2, 2020, 22:49   #15
Dean Anderson
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aszazin View Post
I found another small issue: the lantern makes the walls yellow, but there isn't a difference between granite & magma when the wall is lit.
True. That's basically due to there being a limited colour palette and not enough different shades of yellow to allow them to be distinguished from each other.

Quote:
The selling error is totally consistent in my game. "s" doesn't let me choose how much I want to sell. "d" does let me choose.
I've (eventually!) found and fixed that. For the moment you will have to continue using 'd' to sell things, but in the next release 's' will work properly.[/QUOTE]

Quote:
A question: I'm used to have at least one staircase in both ways on every level. But with my current character I stumbled for a second time on 3-0 without a staircase down.

I'm wondering, is this by design?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aszazin View Post
Because it feels like I got stuck, I started a 2nd game, but there is no shop "4" or "5" (so there is little chance I will obtain words of recall and other potions & scrolls.
(There are 3 black markets, in the other game, there wasn't a black market).

Is it meant like that?
The answer to these two is the same...

Cthangband doesn't just give you a single town and dungeon. Instead there is a whole island containing:
  • 7 normal towns, with a "sewer" (like a small dungeon) under each one
  • 1 special ruined town (Kadath) with a huge dungeon underneath
  • 7 towers in the wilderness, of varying heights, where you go up levels instead of down and the levels are always very small
  • 5 dungeons in the wilderness, of varying sizes

Each of those is randomly placed on the island when you start a new game, with roads connecting the towns; and of the 50 quests you need to do to complete the game, 25 of them are fixed with set uniques in set locations (at least one per tower or dungeon, and one each in two of the "sewers") and the other 25 are randomly generated and could be anywhere.

If you use the 'M' key to view the map while on the surface, you'll see the layout of the island with the towns identified and the dungeons and towers marked but not identified until you visit their locations to see what is there (you leave the town by walking out of one of the four gates in the walls.)

The 7 normal towns each have a different (but fixed) selection of shops in them based on the character of the town (from the source material - H. P. Lovecraft's Dreamlands), and you can start in any one of 6 of the 7 randomly. (The reason one of them is disallowed as a start location is that it doesn't have a "fair" set of shops, being only a small hamlet - although that is one of the two that always has a quest in its sewer.)

Most of the sewers are only 5 levels deep, since they're supposed to be "starter areas" and once you've outgrown them you move on to somewhere else. However, the exceptions are the two towns with quests in the sewers - which have 7 levels each and the quest monster on level 7; the town of Dylath Leen, which has 9 levels (that's also the one with three black markets that you encountered - it's the toughest location to start in); and the town of Celephais - which has a sewer that is only 3 levels deep.

So I'm guessing that you started in Celephais repeatedly and that's why your dungeon stopped at level 3.

As I mentioned, the game where you started in a town with three black markets is one where you started in Dylath Leen. Apart from the poor shop selection, the other reason that's the hardest town is that it has a difficulty of +1 rather than +0. Which brings me on to...

Quote:
Also, I was looking in the manual for the meaning of the level depth with 2 numbers. I suppose the first number is the depth? the second is always zero until now.
The first number is the dungeon level you are on, which is always 1 for the first level below the surface (or above it in the case of towers), then 2, then 3, and so forth.

The second number is the difficulty of the dungeon level you are on. In most of the sewers under the towns this is +0, meaning that the dungeon level is basically what it says. In Dylath Leen (the town with multiple black markets - basically it's a hive of scum and villainy) it is +1. This mean that each level is one level harder (or deeper if you like) that its number would indicate. Effectively the first level has monsters (and treasure, and vaults, etc.) as if it were level two, and the second level has contrents as if it were level three, and so on.

All the external dungeons and towers outside the towns have a difficulty of at least +1, with the maximum being +50; so in that place simply going down the stairs to the first level effectively puts you on "level 51" of the dungeon.

Each dungeon/tower/sewer may also have a bias to a certain type of monster. For example in "The Kobold Fort" you're more likely to meet kobolds, and in "Shelob's Tower" you're more likely to meet spiders, etc.

The wilderness, by the way, has an effective level of 2 in places where there is no dungeon and has a bias towards animals. Where there is a dungeon or tower, the wilderness has a bias the same as that of the dungeon or tower and has a difficulty of half the difficulty of the difficulty or tower. So if you enter a wilderness area and struggle with the monsters there you know you're not hard enough to brave the actual dungeon or tower within.

The map of the island (seen by pressing 'M' while on the surface) shows the number of quests remaining in each location, the difficulty of the location, and the number of levels the location has. However, the latter two pieces of information are only shown once you have found them out. Basically, you need to enter the wilderness around the location to identify which location it is, enter the location itself to identify its difficulty, and get to its last level to identify how many levels it has.

However, the difficulty and number of levels can also be found on Scrolls of Rumour; as can details of the quests within them.

Quote:
Is there a place where I can find more information about the race I'm playing?
I also have a deity mutating me, but I have no idea why and which one. (It is actually fun not to know where some things come from, but it doesn't lessen my curiosity. Btw, who knows what a deeper knowledge of the cosmos will do to me...?)
The information about the races is all displayed during character generation. I thought of putting in extra manual pages for the races but figured that would be thirty extra pages that contained nothing new over and above what's in the character generation screen.

If you're playing a Miri Nigri then you will naturally mutate when you go up a level. No specific deity is involved.

If you're playing a Fanatic or Cultist then you will have a specific patron assigned randomly at character generation (you'll see who it is before accepting the character, so you have chance to reroll it if you're unhappy with the one you got given), and your patron will (usually) give you a reward when you go up a level. This may be a mutation, but that's only one option among many.

If you're a Miri Nigri Fanatic or a Miri Nigri Cultist then you will get both a reward and a mutation when you increase in level. These characters are fun, but too random to be played seriously.

And if you're none of the above then you are very unlikely to get a mutation or a reward, but either (or both) is possible in the right - albeit rather rare - circumstances.

Quote:
I just got an elephantine trunk (1d4) mutation. I cannot find it back in my fighting stats when I open the character sheet.
Mutations aren't included in your character sheet. Whatever damage they do (they only attack once per action regardless of how many attacks per action you normally get) is on top of what is displayed on your character sheet.

The main reason for that is that it would make the display too complicated and too long to fit on the sheet, especially if you have multiple mutations that use different dice.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aszazin View Post
I just found a possible imperfection. I just picked up a bronze rod, and used it to check what it does. It detects traps clearly, as it shows a Dtrap below and marks the area. But the rod wasn't recognized.
After identifying it is a rod of trap location, which I of course already expected.
Possibly this is by design? (don't know if there's also a rod which detects traps and more).
The rod is only identified if it successfully detects a trap.

Bear in mind that if you were already in a DTrap area then you wouldn't have noticed it do anything at all.

Quote:
I never encountered this way of trap detection, where there is a visible indication of the detection and the (annoying) "you are about to leave a trap detected zone" followed by a "you just left a trap detected zone" which I know from other variants. It is the best system so far, in my opinion.
Cthangband doesn't have the annoying messages. It just turns the "DTrap" indicator yellow when you hit the edge of it (and stops you running at that edge).
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Old February 2, 2020, 23:29   #16
Pete Mack
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Torchlit streamer doesn't have to be yellow (though there are two essentially indistinguishable shades of yellow in V angband these days.) You can make magma orange and quartz yellow, since 'magma'* is presumably a dark, near-balck rock.

* which by the way is more properly a synonym for molten lava before it spills out of the volcano.
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Old February 3, 2020, 20:37   #17
Aszazin
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Ah, thanks for all the info.

So I'm not stuck, I just need to start wandering around the island.
Great!

I also noticed the character creation screen explained enough about the races. I missed that due to choosing a random character.

This is really an interesting Angband variant. It's also harder than I'm used too, although consistently using a random character might be partially the cause.
But I like it hard!
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Old February 4, 2020, 17:41   #18
Aszazin
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I found a utter small issue:
-I have 4 daggers 1d4 (+0, +0) & 1 dagger 1d4 (unidentified)
-I go to shop "0" and I do an identify all
-Now I have 4 daggers 1d4 (+0, +0) & 1 dagger 1d4 (+0, +0)
-Only after dropping and picking it up again it becomes 5 daggers 1d4 (+0, +0)

Not a big deal of course!

I'm continuing to play my "stuck" character and moved to a different village. I'm really having fun with Cthangband!
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Old February 5, 2020, 15:12   #19
Aszazin
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Phew, I landed in Kadath... luckily I managed to escape in time...

This game really is balanced in difficulty without becoming too straightforward or streamlined (and thus predictable).

One always needs to be prepared for the worst!

This game is my first encounter with Lovecrafts Cthulu. I definitely need to get deeper in Cthulu.

Shouldn't Hobbes the tiger be replaced by some more Cthulu-like enemy? Something with a sturgeon-like moustache?

edit: oh: just discovered I cannot go over water while wearing a ring of levitation, it says: "You cannot swim", although i can fly.
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Old March 19, 2020, 22:21   #20
Avenger
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I've now upgraded to 6.3, and have a (possible) new bug to report.

The Tarot spell Tarot Draw appears to have far more effects than a single card. Maybe this is not a bug, and is actually intended behavior, but it seems noteworthy. Casting it repeatedly in town lets me safely farm the World and power level my character very quickly... with a single effect, this could still be done, presumably, but would be at a much less game-breaking pace.

Edit: Actually, as I play with it more, it seems to continue drawing until the World is drawn, at which point it stops.

Edit: One more quick issue - every time I attempt to enter the Demon Spire, the game hangs and I have to manually shut it down. No error message, - maybe an infinite loop in map gen?

Edit: Another problem - my Abilities screen doesn't seem to reflect the powers my equipment carries, even after *Identify*ing everything, or drinking !Self Knowledge.
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