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Old February 11, 2008, 00:09   #1
Karzack
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[UN] Suggestions/Ideas

An idea popped into my head today and I thought I would post it. Also, we have a documentation and bug thread for UN so I thought I would start a suggestions/ideas thread.

http://fanaticus.org/DBA/campaigns/LOTR/DBALOTRmap.jpg
I found this map using Google to illustrate my idea.

I know there is already a map, but I thought an interactive map would be cool.

What I was thinking is that when we travel to a different location, that something like this map would show up. Most likely it would be drawn in ASCII. Now imagine that each dot on this map is an area you can travel to. But, only a few dots would be there at the start and others wouldn't appear until you were able to travel to them. Example: Rivendale would appear until you traveled from the Ford. Along with certain areas that don't appear until you beat "X" boss.

Each dot could be color codded for what it is. Be it a town, dungeon, wilderness only, etc. Lets say *red* would be an wilderness area with a dungeon, *blue* could be a town, or *green* could be a wilderness only area. Or, one could just use different symbols.

Now once an area is discovered it could be traveled to from anywhere on the map. With an exception to areas that you can't go back to or whatever the case. When one travels to another area, it would show how much food is needed to travel that distance. If you didn't have enough then you couldn't travel that far, or stop whenever you get weak from hunger. Whatever the case may be.

Now, I know this isn't something that can be done easily. I'm not a programmer, so it's seems like it would take a bit to me. So, ignore it, praise it, whatever. Just a thought that came to mind while playing UN.
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Old February 11, 2008, 01:37   #2
Pete Mack
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Or you can play ToME which uses essentially that map. There's a nice jpeg of it around somewhere, but I can't find the link right now.
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Old February 11, 2008, 13:37   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Karzack View Post
An idea popped into my head today and I thought I would post it. Also, we have a documentation and bug thread for UN so I thought I would start a suggestions/ideas thread.
A donation thread will be next. ;D (We need coders, by the way!)

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I know there is already a map, but I thought an interactive map would be cool.
Yeah, that would be cool. Now that mouse support is being added to Un (and V and FAA, the chief is FAA, I guess) this will be feasable. At least info about location, perhaps also travel via the shortest path to that location.

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What I was thinking is that when we travel to a different location, that something like this map would show up.
It shows up, when you press 'M' in the traveling menu. Not the interactive one, though.

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But, only a few dots would be there at the start and others wouldn't appear until you were able to travel to them.
This is the behaviour of the 'L' screen accesible from the travel menu (or from '~7' normally). Actually, you can also see a bit of the locations one step ahead, e.g. warning if there is no way back.

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Example: Rivendale would appear until you traveled from the Ford. Along with certain areas that don't appear until you beat "X" boss.
In previous versions there were more locations locked by bosses, but it turned out players felt cramped. Now, about half of the map is for free-roaming, though even the free part of the map changes as you beat some bosses. We felt changing is better than unlocking --- you get the best of both worlds: freedom and the world responding to your feats.

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Now once an area is discovered it could be traveled to from anywhere on the map.
Yes, with mouse it would make sense. With the travel menu players were swamped by choices. So, we wait for the mouse stuff.
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Old February 11, 2008, 17:22   #4
Karzack
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I used to play TOME and the one I was thinking of wouldn't quite be like that. But that one would work too.

I never even tried the "L" command when traveling, but I do use the "M" quite a bit. Which is what actually made me think of this.
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Old March 11, 2009, 01:37   #5
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This is a two-parter:

Staying in the spirit of this old thread about maps & the new thread about the UnFellowship Donald started... I came across Scribd.com the other day and found all sorts of old Rolemaster/Merp/Ice roleplaying books. I recall saving up dollars for weeks to get some of these things. Anyway I'm getting nostalgic and off-point... a lot of those manuals have extremely detailed maps and characters and histories and items and all sorts of really interesting stuff. I assume that Angband imported some of this information in some form or another, because I don't recall the Nazgul ever being named before. Anyway, some id at Scribd uploaded all the good books: http://www.scribd.com/bobbyb
I recommend Angus Mcbrides Characters of Middle Earth for cool drawings and some stats/history. Lords of Middle Earth Volume 1 2 3 for stats items and histories for all the major players. Valar and Maiar is good for this too.
And the large locale books for maps and info on well, the locales.
It might seem cheesy at first glance but I think these books are really well done. Un is so atmospheric that it has got me on a LOTR kick that I haven't had in a long while. The old Hobbit and Lotr cartoons, roleplaying... good times.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

On to a more specific problem and suggestion about a map situation: I just lost another character to the Paths of the Dead, but this time it was a different path that let me there. I climbed the tower at Edoras, which was cool, btw, and killed Theoden. A staircase up was created, and after I grabbed up a few artifacts I took the staircase, expecting to be dropped at town level in Edoras, similar to the dropped-back-in-Wilderness-town-staircase after killing the Wolf guardian. But... I land in the Paths of the Dead? Argh!!! It's Hallucination-Bane! I realize that 'magical' staircases in Un are actually representations that one can advance to somewhere new, but in this case I think it's pretty deadly and just not intuitive, at least to me. My suggestion: In Moria, you visit a place where you are given the option of going down and getting stuck (which is badass 'cause the doors collapse), but you can still opt out to travel elsewhere. I would suggest something similar for Paths of the Dead... the square smallish place just like above the Moria entrance where you see a crevasse or something and you can go down it if you want and keep it as a one-way-ticket-thing, but still have the option of retreating to Edoras or Isenguard or something at that point.
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Old March 11, 2009, 10:27   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HallucinationMushroom View Post
I assume that Angband imported some of this information in some form or another, because I don't recall the Nazgul ever being named before.
That's very interesting - I had always wondered where the names for the Nazgul came from.

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It might seem cheesy at first glance but I think these books are really well done.
There has clearly been a huge amount of work put in, and they also seem to have tried hard to keep in theme. Thanks for pointing them out.

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Un is so atmospheric that it has got me on a LOTR kick that I haven't had in a long while.
I'm currently going slowly through Christopher Tolkien's History of Middle Earth (for the second time - I kind of skimmed the first one looking for monsters and artifacts ). Fairly heavy going, but lots of interesting stuff in there - "a host of Balrogs ... assailed the standard of Manwe ... slain with the lightning of his sword" - I can feel another artifact coming on.
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Old March 11, 2009, 17:17   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HallucinationMushroom View Post
But... I land in the Paths of the Dead? Argh!!! It's Hallucination-Bane! I realize that 'magical' staircases in Un are actually representations that one can advance to somewhere new, but in this case I think it's pretty deadly and just not intuitive, at least to me.
Ooops. So it seems, while the road to Paths of the Dead using the wilderness commands (up, while not standing on a staircase) give you due warnings, the way through the staircase does not? If so, that's a great hole in (my, actucally) design of the early warning system.

OTOH, it's a good idea to look at the dungeon knowledge screen once you've slain the guardian and it would tell you he guarded the way to Paths of the Dead, and then IIRC you are certain to get there via the stairs... Probably the Paths are marked as accessible at this very moment, too, so you can see their description and be duly warned. Those reckless adventurers, these days...
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Old March 11, 2009, 17:51   #8
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Ah, I'm glad you like them Nick. In one of the books, Lords of the Middle Earth 1 The Immortals I think, it gives stats and items for the Balrog. This was my first time to encounter Calris. Ah, the Balrog's sword, total wigness! It also mentions that he has a whip, Cuivigerth, or some such name.

Ah, yes, good suggestions Bandobras, reading through this old post I learned that I can use the 'L' key to see more detailed inforation about locales, and never would've thought to read through more detailed character information. Duly noted.
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Old March 11, 2009, 19:13   #9
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FYI, I made a map some time ago of the whole world. It's very sloppy at the moment, and I had planned to remake it nicer, but it might help navigate in the meantime.
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Old March 15, 2009, 00:59   #10
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FYI, I made a map some time ago of the whole world. It's very sloppy at the moment, and I had planned to remake it nicer, but it might help navigate in the meantime.
IIRC Pete Mac did an automatically built version at some point but I like your hand drawn layout.

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