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Old October 15, 2016, 12:10   #41
DavidB1111
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I found another bug, scrolls of *Remove Curse* don't get rid of the Aggravation flag from Rune Swords when their thirst redoubles.
It used to do that, and it does make sense that you can keep it calmed down a bit.
So, that might need to be fixed.

I don't care if my weapon is 9d4, having over 100 monsters beeline for my head at the exact second I enter a dungeon floor doesn't exactly make that damage dice helpful.

I'm hoping this can get fixed, otherwise someone is going to have to guide me through playing with Aggravation.

Last edited by DavidB1111; October 15, 2016 at 20:11.
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Old October 15, 2016, 14:45   #42
isildiy
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Hi
In the newest version (5.2) the recharge spell of the sorcery school seems to be broken. I cant recharge anything with my beastman bloodmage. It would be very nice if somebody could provide a quick fix, because that char is very device dependent and I can't continue the game with this bug.

I tested it out with a munchkin android sorcerer, and the recharge spell worked for it! I believe that it doesnt work because of the new device system and how it seems to "drain" mana from the players pool into the chosen device pool. I guess the bug arises because bloodmage has no mana to transfer and no mechanism may have been coded to transfer from his hp pool to the device?

thx!
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Old October 18, 2016, 20:24   #43
Regalia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidB1111 View Post
I found another bug, scrolls of *Remove Curse* don't get rid of the Aggravation flag from Rune Swords when their thirst redoubles.
It used to do that, and it does make sense that you can keep it calmed down a bit.
So, that might need to be fixed.

I don't care if my weapon is 9d4, having over 100 monsters beeline for my head at the exact second I enter a dungeon floor doesn't exactly make that damage dice helpful.

I'm hoping this can get fixed, otherwise someone is going to have to guide me through playing with Aggravation.
Don't move much, let the monsters come to you. Having replenishable destruction is good. Use detection even more often.

That or play a psion. They can suppress aggravation.
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Old October 18, 2016, 22:57   #44
GenericPseudonym
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidB1111 View Post
I found another bug, scrolls of *Remove Curse* don't get rid of the Aggravation flag from Rune Swords when their thirst redoubles.
It used to do that, and it does make sense that you can keep it calmed down a bit.
So, that might need to be fixed.

I don't care if my weapon is 9d4, having over 100 monsters beeline for my head at the exact second I enter a dungeon floor doesn't exactly make that damage dice helpful.

I'm hoping this can get fixed, otherwise someone is going to have to guide me through playing with Aggravation.
If the aggravation gets too much for you, you can always get yourself free with a scroll of mundanity: it'll ruin your rune-sword by irreversibly turning it into a mundane (+0,+0) item, but it removes the permanent curse. Also works for any other permanently cursed equipment you get tired of.

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That or play a psion. They can suppress aggravation.
You can also suppress aggravation by being a shadow-fairy or a level 40+ scout, although with any of the three it still significantly penalizes your stealth skill.
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Old October 19, 2016, 22:18   #45
DavidB1111
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Okay, I can kind of live with the Aggravation, I just want to know why it's no longer affected by the *Remove Curse* scroll which removes heavy curses, which Aggravation usually is considered. I'm not trying to remove Aggravation from the major few Aggravation Cursed Swords/weapons.

And destroying the Rune Sword on a Rune Sword character seems a bit excessive, especially since getting it to 9d4 was an exercise of tediousness, and I still can't figure out the dang formula.

Detection is not that much of an issue. Wizard Mode acts like Super Telepathy.
Now, if only I could figure out why there are so many Debug mode and Wizard mode and Cheat mode bugs in this version compared to earlier versions.

Something completely broke the Flags setting so you can't actually see what flags an item has, in Control-A o, which plays with an object. Cheat flag for objects is completely broken and only triggers on artifacts or Randarts. Which means you got a whole lot of identify fun times ahead.

Mainly, I'm just confused why Rune Swords had to get the *remove curse* flag not to work on the only thing it should work on.
You get an enemy to curse it, you can remove that just fine.
Aggravation is most certainly not the same as Permanently cursed. And it doesn't just swap your Rune Sword out with one with built in Aggravation, it literally just applies it to it.
Ergo, it should be removed with *Remove Curse*

I mean, why is keeping a sentient angry sword calm a bad thing?
Maybe make it so if you eat enough souls, it goes away.

Last edited by DavidB1111; October 19, 2016 at 22:53.
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Old October 20, 2016, 21:28   #46
GenericPseudonym
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Well there are two ways for an item to get aggravation. It can have built-in aggravation (like, say, Grond) or it can get it as a random side-effect from a curse. Unless the aggravation was added by cursing the item, it can't be removed by uncursing the item. And what runeswords get is the built-in kind, just like they get built-in brands or built-in dice bonuses.

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Originally Posted by DavidB1111 View Post
Maybe make it so if you eat enough souls, it goes away.
Actually it shows up when you eat enough souls! Runeswords get permanent aggravation once their dice * sides are greater than 30 (and "The thirst of your sword redoubles!"), and if you get dice * sides > 60 you'll get an even more fun suprise.

Generally how runeswords work: first they randomly decide whether to increase tohit, damage, dice or sides. Then they compare the killed monster's level to the current value -- low level monsters won't get you any bonus. There's a random chance to either increase the value it picked or fail. Uniques are 6x as likely to successfuly add damage dice or sides, and never fail to add enchantment.

Lastly, when you kill a unique, there's a random chance based on its level to add a random brand.


Oh yeah, and if you want to identify things in wizmode i'm sure there's a separate command for that rather than using the flag tweak thing.
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Old October 20, 2016, 21:46   #47
krazyhades
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Early on the aggravation can be removed by uncursing, but later on the runesword gets it permanently.
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Old October 20, 2016, 22:15   #48
DavidB1111
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Originally Posted by GenericPseudonym View Post
Well there are two ways for an item to get aggravation. It can have built-in aggravation (like, say, Grond) or it can get it as a random side-effect from a curse. Unless the aggravation was added by cursing the item, it can't be removed by uncursing the item. And what runeswords get is the built-in kind, just like they get built-in brands or built-in dice bonuses.


Actually it shows up when you eat enough souls! Runeswords get permanent aggravation once their dice * sides are greater than 30 (and "The thirst of your sword redoubles!"), and if you get dice * sides > 60 you'll get an even more fun suprise.

Generally how runeswords work: first they randomly decide whether to increase tohit, damage, dice or sides. Then they compare the killed monster's level to the current value -- low level monsters won't get you any bonus. There's a random chance to either increase the value it picked or fail. Uniques are 6x as likely to successfuly add damage dice or sides, and never fail to add enchantment.

Lastly, when you kill a unique, there's a random chance based on its level to add a random brand.


Oh yeah, and if you want to identify things in wizmode i'm sure there's a separate command for that rather than using the flag tweak thing.
But the runesword was able to remove the aggravation flag from using a Scroll of *remove Curse* always. I want to know why this was changed. Killing the first enemy to get that flag was the point where you could remove it.
This is what really threw me through a loop.

It was not a built in version of Aggravation, otherwise, it would have been impossible to ever remove it. So either it was somehow changed to swap out your runesword with one with built in aggro like Grond, or something broke somewhere.

I've never seen it get that high up on the list to see the other fun surprise though. And if it gets the TY_Curse, well, I'm going to have a blacksmith forge Grond in real life, and smack the person who thought that was a good idea with it, and yes, it will more than likely have the Earthquake flag even in the real world. It's a 100 pound hammer after all. Don't ask how I'm going to pick it up.

Also, I dare say it doesn't need Aggravation in the first place. It doesn't scream and yell as you carry it around. It's a permanently cursed item, it doesn't need every negative in the game.

Remember, the terror Mask was already nerfed into oblivion by always having the Ty_Curse on it, while in Zangband, it has two distinct versions of itself, and both of them most certainly does not have the TY_Curse.


I'm not using the debug Object modify to identify items. I use it to reroll things occasionally. The flags are completely broken totally and utterly. This is a bug, unless it was designed to make cheater's heads explode.

And I've had plenty of uniques being killed without giving any enchantment, to hit or otherwise, so their 6x times more likely to do something doesn't seem to work all that well.

It's nice to know that the chance is based on the level of the enemy I suppose.

I just feel as though unnecessary nerfs to a Runesword's Aggravation flag is a bit unkind.

What next, it just hits you in the face randomly if you try to rest? "No, kill things!"

Let's look at the Gloves of Thanos. Who would ever use those. No those two immunities are not that good early on. Let's not make the Runesword the new Gloves of Thanos.
And why would the Gloves of the Greek God of Death/Marvel's Thanos be so heavily cursed? Also, isn't Infinity Gauntlet a randart name?

Now, if it was a bug that the *Remove Curse* scroll worked on Runeswords, I can understand that, but in my experience, they were never designed to replace themselves with Grond so to speak.

And honestly, I can't fathom why anyone would ever want to use any item with Aggravation ever. The entire point of it is to make whatever item it is on completely worthless except for the most randomly overpowered builds of all time, and Trump Cyberdemon spam is not one of them, or Trump Call the Void, or Trump Summon Donald. Wait that last one doesn't exist...

Even the TY_Curse has less irritating results than Aggravation, and that includes when it had the ability to summon Cyberdemons and Paralyze you without it being in Nightmare mode.
Amberlite curses are more fun than Aggravation. OOD summoning of uniques and hasting them with "Shriek." is more fun.
Unless you're a Death Sword, Amberlite curses are really annoying, for a death sword, they don't seem to spam Cyberdemons. Or even activate most of the time.

Chaos brand on swords are less annoying than Aggravation and the stupid polymorph makes it useless.

Heck, I think most people would rather have a turn on the Rack than deal with Aggravation in an Angband variant.

If you're only on the Rack for a little while, it just makes you grow a few inches painfully.

And yes, I know I tend to ramble on a bit and write walls of text. "David breaths confusion! You are confused!" Feel free to add that to your signature.

Last edited by DavidB1111; October 20, 2016 at 22:34.
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Old October 21, 2016, 07:15   #49
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Aggravation is not really as terrible as you say it is unless you play on always_small_levels. You just have to frequently use detection so you know when a monster is going to come close enough to get aggravated, and when they do get close enough you have to expect to fight them (aka don't go rushing forwards and waking up more things or you'll end up having to fight multiple nasties at once).

I'd much rather have aggravate and know when scary things are headed for me than have ty curse and potentially get randomly covered in cyberdemons at any time.
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Old October 21, 2016, 10:05   #50
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Okay, fair enough. I just hate Aggravation with the fiery passion of a thousand burning suns.

I can live with it, even if it's a pain to deal with neverending zerg rushes.
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