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Old April 12, 2015, 00:31   #111
mushroom patch
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I am not saying that grinding is never important. I'm saying that when it is, that's a design flaw. (I recognize that some games are designed to make money rather than to provide a clean and compelling game experience and in these games, hooking the player with repetitive tasks makes sense.) It's true, in angband it's optimal to grind for consumables in the endgame most of the time. It would be great if there were a good proposal to address this, because it's not good.

While there are probably "play styles" that involve goofying off and not winning (which is fine), games with actual objectives shouldn't cater to them. Doing so sends the player the message that, for example, hauling empty treasure chests is what they're supposed to be doing to progress in the game.
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Old April 12, 2015, 01:57   #112
Ingwe Ingweron
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Many years ago, in the long ago days of Dungeons and Dragons, there was once a magical item known as the "portable hole". A piece of black cloth that you could fold up and put in your pocket. But what a piece of cloth it was! An extra-dimensional 15' cubed space where you could store all kinds of things (including the kitchen sink). And when you put things in there, the cloth never weighed anything more than the few ounces of fabric. I've often wished I had one of those in real life.

However, I have to agree with those on this forum that are against the idea of an ever expanding home, whether that expansion is through paginated menus, additional rooms, hauling chests out of the dungeon to add storage space, or even a portable hole. Being a pack rat doesn't help learn to win the game. Sure, one could conceivably haul any potential item out and store it in an infinite home against the day of eventually taking on Morgoth. But all that wasted time and effort actually increases the amount of time the player is exposed to risks. Plus, one of the inherent challenges of the game is to manage inventory, including the limited space in the home. Let's not add portable holes to this game.
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Old April 12, 2015, 02:15   #113
Malak Darkhunter
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The only thing I would wish here is a mathom house to drop artifacts into so you can go back and look at them...you can't get them back of course because that would be unfair to the game. The reason I would wish this is because I absolutely hate dropping artifacts and getting rid of them permanently to make more room in the house and to clean out uneeded artifacts. I enjoy looking at what I've found throughout the game, and that helps sometimes plan for the next game, and I enjoy reading their descriptions.
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Old April 12, 2015, 16:12   #114
AnonymousHero
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ingwe Ingweron View Post
Being a pack rat doesn't help learn to win the game. Sure, one could conceivably haul any potential item out and store it in an infinite home against the day of eventually taking on Morgoth. But all that wasted time and effort actually increases the amount of time the player is exposed to risks. Plus, one of the inherent challenges of the game is to manage inventory, including the limited space in the home. Let's not add portable holes to this game.
No, but it removes the tedium of having to decide permanently between items which may not have much to differentiate them. If it's a challenge, then it's a boring and entirely invented one! (It's basically in the same realm as Identify vs. *Identify*.). An infinite home lets the player spend more time in the dungeon, advancing the game.

Infinite home works (gameplay-wise) marvelously in, say, Entroband/Chengband, so I see no reason it shouldn't work in Vanilla. (Implementation details aside, of course.)

Last edited by AnonymousHero; April 12, 2015 at 21:39.
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Old April 12, 2015, 17:22   #115
Cold_Heart
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Please increase the home size. This is much needed.

+100% more slots for 100k gold

then 200k
then 400k
then 800k 1.6kk 3.2kk ...

makes somewhat decent gold sink too
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Old April 12, 2015, 17:58   #116
MattB
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cold_Heart View Post
Please increase the home size. This is much needed.

+100% more slots for 100k gold

then 200k
then 400k
then 800k 1.6kk 3.2kk ...

makes somewhat decent gold sink too
I don't think this is a bad idea. But I would want something like:

+2 slots for 100k
+2 slots for 200k
+2 slots for 400k
etc. etc.

As Cold Heart says, it would be good to get rid of gold somehow.
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Old April 13, 2015, 14:22   #117
Zireael
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I like the idea of buying space with gold. Exact numbers may vary
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Old April 14, 2015, 12:24   #118
the Invisible Stalker
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnonymousHero View Post
If it's a challenge, then it's a boring and entirely invented one!
All challenges in Angband are entirely invented. People seem to differ on what they find boring. I find melee tedious, for example, but judging from the number of warriors on the ladder clearly some people enjoy it.
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Old April 15, 2015, 00:38   #119
MattB
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the Invisible Stalker View Post
All challenges in Angband are entirely invented. People seem to differ on what they find boring. I find melee tedious, for example, but judging from the number of warriors on the ladder clearly some people enjoy it.
Quite right. I find spells boring.
Ah, for the thrill of holding down an arrow key for as long as you dare before releasing it...it's a drug to me!
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Old April 15, 2015, 03:14   #120
AnonymousHero
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the Invisible Stalker View Post
All challenges in Angband are entirely invented. People seem to differ on what they find boring. I find melee tedious, for example, but judging from the number of warriors on the ladder clearly some people enjoy it.
Sorry, should have said "artificial" or "pointless", I guess. Melee/Magic, whatever... that's an intrinsic part of the game that gets you closer to the actual goal, killing the big P. Shuffling inventory and equipment... no so much. (Well it does in a very roundabout way, but, personally it takes me at least 30 min. and an existential quandry of "why, exactly, am I playing this game?" before I get back into the dungeon. Maybe it's just me, but I don't think I'm alone in finding the inevitable equip/house-shuffle tedious and boring.)
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