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Old April 2, 2018, 10:08   #71
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yes its strict honor system ofc

but if a few ppl start running and ppl pay attention to the play im sure viewers will be able to ID an abuser

Reality hits you -more-

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Old April 6, 2018, 12:52   #72
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skip 24

When Derakon mentioned skip 25 I thought how silly, surely no one tries that? But then I was bored, so I set level skip to 24 and gold start to 15,000 (too high!) and rolled up my favorite combo: HT/Warrior. I had a pretty good start:

I went on to win the game. I didn't have deep descent on, but I did put on disconnected stairs to discourage level scumming. I will not post the whole adventure as I am a slow and boring player to watch (my game took 14 hours), but I may post highlights since I did record the entire thing (it took about 13 hours 40 minutes).
Detailed account of my Ironman win here.

Last edited by Grotug; April 6, 2018 at 13:10.
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Old April 6, 2018, 14:03   #73
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I think a good system for adjusting gold at the start to make level skip games more fair is to add 125 starting gold for each level skipped. So if playing with skip level is 1 (the default), starting gold is 600. If level Skip is 2 then starting gold would be 600 + 125 = 725. For a level 24 skip game, starting gold would be: 23 X 125 = 2875 + 600 = 3475.

Here's a failed attempt I just did, but that is demonstrable of how feasible (and fun) this mode of playing is. The starting gold feels quite right to me.

Here's another amusing/fun failed attempt:

This one I really shouldn't have died. Needlessly threw away a promising start. :-/ Starting supplies were some light armors, 30 phase doors, 40 charges of wands of wonder (2). No weapon. 22 CLWs. 4 Infravision potions. 5 ?Magic Mapping. 1 Detect Evil (which I forgot to use at the start).
Detailed account of my Ironman win here.
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Old April 6, 2018, 17:34   #74
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Ha, that's awesome. I'm glad players are able to do experiments like this now.
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Old December 5, 2018, 14:12   #75
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I'm reviving this thread because yesterday I made my lowst turncount win and started in the morning and finished in the evening. Since I record all my games I was able to figure out just how fast that 27,384k turn win took in real time. The game started at approximately 8:21am and finished at 8:56pm with some breaks in-between. I wasn't trying for a real-time record, just another low turn count win. I've added up the videos and tallied the total time of actually playing the game (total recording time from start to finish). This time includes deliberations while staring at my screen, trying to decide my next move. I do not stop recording during this time. It also includes the time it takes me to zoom in on the screen after starting the recording for each play session.

There is no force-quitting the game when things go south. This is a legit win like all my wins unless I've admitted to force-quitting (which I used to do but haven't done in a long time). The continuity of the videos will attest to this (if I decide there is enough interest in this account for me to upload them).

Race: Half Troll
Class: Warrior

Starting stats:

Random artifacts: Yes
Connected stairs: No
Force player descent: Yes
Word of Recall has no effect: No
Restrict creation of artifacts: No
Stack objects on the floor: Yes
Lose artifacts when leaving level: No
Show level feelings: Yes
Increase gold drops but disable selling: Yes
Start with a kit of useful gear: No
Monsters learn from their mistakes: No
Know all runes on birth: No
Know all flavors on birth: No
Persistent levels: No

On the ladder:

Strategy: Lately my strategy has been to buy 3 to 5 scrolls of mapping at the start if they are available to reduce turns wasted wandering around levels that are unnecessary for HT/Warrior. The rest of my gold was spent on a !CLW and ?phase doors. Punching things is fine for the first 7 dungeon levels. That's basically it. Otherwise, if I saw stairs I generally took them immediately, unless something of interest led me to explore a level some.

The game was won over the course of 5 videos:

format: hour:minute:seconds

Video 1: 2:22:14 and I reached DL47. Took a break because I was outside a vault and had nearly died moments ago.

Video 2: 0:40:29 and I reached DL50.

Video 3: 2:41:46 and I reached DL70 and took a break after nearly completing a raid of a large vault (and when I came back even though I had taken a breather I still forgot the slay evil weapon in the dungeon that would been my best bet against Morgoth).

Video 4: 0:26:25 and I reached DL72

Video 5: 2:16:14 and I reached DL100 and took 12 minutes on DL100 to defeat the boss.

If my math is right, my grand total playing time, from character creation screen to ***WINNER*** displayed on the screen was less than 8 hours and 27 minutes.

If anyone wants me to upload all these videos to youtube as video evidence I'm happy to do so, but will only do it if I receive a request to do so.

Dunno if dos350 has visited these boards recently or not.
Detailed account of my Ironman win here.
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Old December 5, 2018, 16:05   #76
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Hi Grotug.

Your constant attempts at getting faster and faster wins made me try the diving game too. It's somewhat a different game when doing it ironman but really not that much.

That option you have NOT on: Know all flavors on birth. I just had to turn it on since ironman players don't have any other way of id'ing it than trying it once. This creates some tactical situations I do not appreciate. Like having to read unknown scrolls on top of the downstairs, potentially losing DeepDescent, RuneofProt scroll.

Keep the speedruns coming, man! You worried about posting a bit too many travel stories here, but I'd say nonsense. This community does not have enough of those.
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Old December 8, 2018, 17:52   #77
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The Mages Guide to Power

I consider myself very experienced in Angband. I posted the player history with many notes about what i did or thought in the game playing experience section, with the same title as this post has.

But i must say 8 hrs - i can't see that as mage. I required almost 17 hours total playing time.

A strong indicator for me that the mage power curve is not steep enough during mid-game. And end-game damage just sux ... not as much as priests, but well.
Blondes are more fun!
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Old December 11, 2018, 20:11   #78
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Originally Posted by Tibarius View Post
But i must say 8 hrs - i can't see that as mage.
I just timed my first game with the new mage, so as to get an idea about what proportion of my life is claimed by Angband (or, if you prefer, what proportion of my Angband life is claimed by the real world). Took 570 minutes, i.e. 9 and a half hours, at what I'd describe as a leisurely pace. So I'd say 8 hours are definitely doable, at least if you're willing to exploit asymmetric LOS.

Tibarius - the main time difference between our runs is that I only spent 2 hours after 4000'.
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Old December 14, 2018, 08:56   #79
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Originally Posted by Sphara View Post
Hi Grotug.

Keep the speedruns coming, man! You worried about posting a bit too many travel stories here, but I'd say nonsense.
I'll second that. Very entertaining and educational.
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Old January 9, 2019, 01:02   #80
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As a great speedruns lover (and player), I clearly enjoy the idea of speedrunning Angband.

I don't know the game enough for that (watching efficient runs could help on this), but the insanely random aspect of the game still looks like a serious issue to me (Hello, ring of Dilion ^^)
> Would quickband and/or tinyband be more suited for that ? I only tried them a bit, but IIRC, I could quickly dive to the bosses... and was capped by my lack of stuff. Maybe I just sucked ? Else, it might just be a matter of enabling autoscum and/or improving drop quality at the lowest depth.

IMO, such a challenge would really benefit from a dedicated "variant" (or correct Vanilla configuration ; )
I'd bet a game with finite levels would be more comfortable to play, and especially, to speedrun.
Games like Binding of Isaac, FTL, DoomRL or Slay the spire all have in common the "ironman" aspect of not giving the possibility to scum levels for stuff, and the good thing is... it's actually unnecessary !

From my (Angband noobie... but ardent and perfectionnist speedrunner) point of view, this is more or less what currently lacks in Angband.
This need for scumming can make runs very boring at some point, when you are desesparetely looking for some good stuff which doesn't show up.
One of my recent chars spent a lot of time around DL40/50 without RPoison, and 10 or barely more speed... I still wonder how I managed to not end-up killed by some surprise drolem, or one of those lvl 60/75 uniques in those vaults

The problem, of course, is that the initial game is not designed for this "ironman" setting
> The drop rates (or system) would need tweaks to make things "quite balanced". (Just increasing drop rates ? Giving basic "guaranties" for the most vital bonuses, like some plusses to speed ? Sorting egos and artifacts by tiers ? Etc.)[/I]
> The monster generation would probably need some rework too, and I don't have much inspiration to handle the fact that currently, difficult fight are supposed to be picked only when relevant. (From my experience, in most "rogue-lites", you tend to avoid skipping fights, since rewards are what make you progress)

Of course, actually improving things is always much harder than just spotting flaws and room for improvement, but I love the idea, so I put my two cents in.
(And would be glad to help playtesting such a speedrun-oriented version)
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speed, speedrun

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