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Old June 4, 2010, 08:36   #1
Timo Pietilš
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Time attacks and HOW much did I lose stats?

Hello.

I was just wondering around fully knowing that there is time vortex nearby. I decided that I should shoot it down (needed two hits).

First one: miss
Time Vortex breathes time: All of your stats are drained
Second one: hit:
Time Vortex breathes time: All of your stats are drained
Third one: hit:
Time Vortex dies

Two all stats drained, hm how much... Argh! STR went from 18/20 to 12. Others also pretty much same.

(and of course temple doesn't have restore STR, buing it out five times before such thing appeared, then going to BM I find Potion of STR. Figures.)

Anyway: How much can time breath actually drain your stats? That was a lot more than I expected. I usually don't let them breath or if they do they take only one stat down, getting two all stats-hit in a row is a rarity.
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Old June 4, 2010, 15:17   #2
Derakon
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Results of time breath (from spells1.c):

5 in 10 chance: you lose 2% of your experience points
4 in 10 chance: a single random stat is reduced to 75% of its current value
1 in 10 chance: every stat is reduced to 75% of its current value

You just got rather unlucky, that's all.
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Old June 4, 2010, 15:32   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Derakon View Post
Results of time breath (from spells1.c):

5 in 10 chance: you lose 2% of your experience points
4 in 10 chance: a single random stat is reduced to 75% of its current value
1 in 10 chance: every stat is reduced to 75% of its current value

You just got rather unlucky, that's all.
I find these damages punitive enough that I'll destruct or banish time or aether hounds and time vortices. If I have a lot of speed I might try to TO the occasional hound or vortex. Either way they belong in the group of monsters that I never fight. The only other monsters in this group are the tougher golems and beholders.
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Old June 4, 2010, 16:06   #4
Derakon
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It's particularly nasty in that time attacks cannot be resisted and there's no saving throw. Fortunately there's only four time breathers in the game, and two of them are Aether [vortices|hounds], which, given that they have 19 breath attacks to choose from, are unlikely to pick time. That said, time hounds can be pretty nasty, especially since they're at +20 speed and each breath (for an unwounded hound) is 110 damage.
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Old June 4, 2010, 16:19   #5
Tiburon Silverflame
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This is why standard mage tactics, once you've got the book for it, is to Banish on Z and v, at the very least; s (druj), L (demilich, Black Reaver) and Q (ANY of them by this point) are next on the priority list for me.

If you only have the occasional scroll, then I'd either

a) wait a bit to see which of those might be showing, or
b) take out the hounds first, as they pose the greatest general risk IMO, altho the liches would also make sense. Sure, you can TO that Black Reaver, but it'll come back...and create tunnels along the way that make the dungeon too open, and let everything get near you too easily.
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Old June 4, 2010, 17:59   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Timo Pietilš View Post
Argh! STR went from 18/20 to 12. Others also pretty much same.
That seems like a recent change, unless you are talking about final values instead of internal values. The question is how you measure 18/20. It used to be 18+20 = 38. Then (38 * 3 / 4) * 3 / 4 = 21 = 18/03 is hardly a problem. But (17 * 3 / 4) * 3 / 4 = 9 is really painful.

I remember complaining about this, but my suggestion was to weaken the attack, not to strengthen it for 18/xx values. If it changed, you can blame me for bringing it up.
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Old June 4, 2010, 18:44   #7
Timo Pietilš
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PowerDiver View Post
That seems like a recent change, unless you are talking about final values instead of internal values. The question is how you measure 18/20. It used to be 18+20 = 38. Then (38 * 3 / 4) * 3 / 4 = 21 = 18/03 is hardly a problem. But (17 * 3 / 4) * 3 / 4 = 9 is really painful.
I'm talking about final values. Class bonus is 2 Equipment bonus 1 and internal was 17.

Using that calc: 17 * 3/4 = 12 * 3/4 = 9 + 3 = 12 which is what I got.

Isn't 18/20 just 20 and not 38? 18/200 would be 38. 18/220 would be 40.
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Old June 4, 2010, 19:03   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Timo Pietilš View Post
I'm talking about final values. Class bonus is 2 Equipment bonus 1 and internal was 17.

Using that calc: 17 * 3/4 = 12 * 3/4 = 9 + 3 = 12 which is what I got.

Isn't 18/20 just 20 and not 38? 18/200 would be 38. 18/220 would be 40.
nope. 18/20 is definitely 38. 18/200 is 218. Personally, I think it's a bad system and would much prefer stats go from 3-40. It's silly to me to coopt a poorly made D&D system.
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Old June 4, 2010, 19:10   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Timo Pietilš View Post
Isn't 18/20 just 20 and not 38? 18/200 would be 38. 18/220 would be 40.
That's for the index into the tables. Time works differently. The difference in its effects between 17 and 18/20 is absurd. Add this to my list of reasons to eliminate the percentile thing.

There is no 18/200 as it attacks internal stats only, but 18/100 -> 118 so there you would lose 30, dropping down to 18/70.
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Old June 4, 2010, 19:50   #10
Zikke
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a Rod of Restoration works well in this situation. Or the priest spells
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