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Old February 10, 2011, 15:37   #1
dcztmband
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(LOST) inscription and option (adult_no_preserve)

Hi,

in some character dumps there are lines like this one

Code:
7570450   4850'   50   Found The Broad Sword 'Arunruth' (LOST)
What means:
Code:
(LOST)
In my options I have this:

Code:
Lose artifacts when leaving level            : no  (adult_no_preserve)
Does this mean, if I leave the level with an unidentified (or undiscovered?) artifact on it, I can still find it later in the game? So the artifact it's not totally lost for me, right?

Thanks!
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Old February 10, 2011, 16:11   #2
d_m
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If you leave a "known" artifact lying on the floor and leave a level, that artifact is LOST (and marked that way in the log).

If you play with no_preserve=TRUE (or play a really old version of Angband) then leaving *unknown* artifacts on the floor also looses then. If you play with no_preserve=FALSE then those artifacts are not lost.

The V nightlies have removed the no_preserve option, so unknown artifacts are always preserved.
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Old February 10, 2011, 16:13   #3
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With preserve mode off, you lose an artifact if you leave a level without picking it up after it is generated (either on the floor or from a monster drop). With it on, you lose an artifact if you leave it on a level after having identified it, or if you sell it to a store and then that store refreshes its inventory.

You are guaranteed to lose some artifacts eventually as there is not enough carrying capacity in the game to accept all of them.
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Old February 11, 2011, 09:43   #4
Timo Pietilš
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Quote:
Originally Posted by d_m View Post
The V nightlies have removed the no_preserve option, so unknown artifacts are always preserved.
Why change that? I sometimes enjoy playing with no-preserve. I even posted a competition with that set a while a back.

Did devs also remove no-stacking and other "difficulty" settings like no-stores, no-artifacts and no-stairs? no-preserve is no different to those.
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Old February 11, 2011, 15:20   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Timo Pietilš View Post
Why change that? I sometimes enjoy playing with no-preserve. I even posted a competition with that set a while a back.

Did devs also remove no-stacking and other "difficulty" settings like no-stores, no-artifacts and no-stairs? no-preserve is no different to those.
You'll have to ask Takkaria... I just remember that at some point the options were compacted; I don't think there was a huge discussion of it (and in fact the last time I talked about compacting options I remember Magnate wanting to keep the preserve mode).

Obviously it's easy to check a nightly to see which difficulty settings are there, but I will list them anyway:

Code:
    a) Maximise effect of race/class bonuses        : yes  (birth_maximize)    
    b) Randomise the artifacts (except a very few)  : no   (birth_randarts)    
    c) Monsters chase current location              : yes  (birth_ai_sound)    
    d) Monsters chase recent locations              : yes  (birth_ai_smell)    
    e) Monsters act smarter in groups               : yes  (birth_ai_packs)    
    f) Monsters learn from their mistakes           : no   (birth_ai_learn)    
    g) Monsters exploit player's weaknesses         : no   (birth_ai_cheat)    
    h) Monsters behave more intelligently (broken)  : no   (birth_ai_smart)    
    i) Restrict the use of stairs/recall            : no   (birth_ironman)     
    j) Restrict the use of stores/home              : no   (birth_no_stores)   
    k) Restrict creation of artifacts               : no   (birth_no_artifacts)
    l) Don't stack objects on the floor             : no   (birth_no_stacking) 
    m) Lose artifacts when leaving level            : no   (birth_no_preserve) 
    o) Don't generate connected stairs              : no   (birth_no_stairs)   
    p) Don't show level feelings                    : no   (birth_no_feelings) 
    q) Items always sell for 0 gold                 : no   (birth_no_selling)
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Old February 11, 2011, 15:33   #6
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That list includes no_preserve as an option..

If you're tossing options, why not toss no_feelings? It's not like feelings give much useful info anyway, so they're really easy to ignore.
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Old February 11, 2011, 16:17   #7
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Oh wait, preserve mode is still there?

That's strange, I thought Takkaria specifically removed it. But yeah, looking at the code, there it is. Weird.

Well, Timo, looks like your option is safe after all!
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Old February 11, 2011, 16:17   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by d_m View Post
Code:
    
    m) Lose artifacts when leaving level            : no   (birth_no_preserve)
Looks like it still is there. False alarm?
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Old February 11, 2011, 16:19   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by d_m View Post
Oh wait, preserve mode is still there?

That's strange, I thought Takkaria specifically removed it. But yeah, looking at the code, there it is. Weird.

Well, Timo, looks like your option is safe after all!
Looks like it. Good.
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Old February 11, 2011, 20:20   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Derakon View Post
With preserve mode off, you lose an artifact if you leave a level without picking it up after it is generated (either on the floor or from a monster drop). With it on, you lose an artifact if you leave it on a level after having identified it, or if you sell it to a store and then that store refreshes its inventory.

You are guaranteed to lose some artifacts eventually as there is not enough carrying capacity in the game to accept all of them.
All right, thank you very much for the enlightenment !

All the best!
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