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Old July 20, 2021, 16:48   #1
Selkie
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The Watcher in the Water

Would anybody else like to see the Watcher in the Water included as a vanilla unique?

It's one of the most mysterious monsters in the trilogy and deserves a cameo in Angband.

My suggestion would be a non-summoning, living, evil, animal creature with a capital "M". It can strangle to attack eight times, can cause whirlpools. I think it should be very high HP. I think it should also have the ability to hold you (perhaps a mechanic similar to webs, because free action would be too common by this stage)

Ok now I'm going to go sightly off-piste...

Essentially it was a sort of gatekeeper to Moria and I like the idea of having a challenging, mid-game unique you have to kill in order to advance further - at dlvl 50 for example.

If there's interest then I'll happily write a sample flavour text.
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Old July 20, 2021, 16:56   #2
Pete Mack
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The Watcher doesnt belong in the Pits of Angband (neither does the Balrog of Moria, but presumably remains for historical reasons, from when the game actually was Moria .)
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Old July 20, 2021, 17:08   #3
Selkie
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete Mack View Post
The Watcher doesnt belong in the Pits of Angband (neither does the Balrog of Moria, but presumably remains for historical reasons, from when the game actually was Moria .)
Nah, I don't buy that argument. I think Angband is just a wrapper for the entire Tolkien universe. Otherwise what is old man willow doing in Angband?
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Old July 20, 2021, 17:21   #4
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He was a recent addition that i dont really like. Sil does a better job of plants in the dungeon.
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Old July 20, 2021, 17:28   #5
Selkie
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete Mack View Post
He was a recent addition that i dont really like. Sil does a better job of plants in the dungeon.
Well old man willow is not the only exception. The entire game is totally anachronistic and littered with monsters who would never have set foot in Angband.

The Watcher in the Water was likely a creature created by Morgoth (I'm sure I read Tolkien wrote that). So it's likely he was created in Utumno and is therefore highly canonical
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Old July 20, 2021, 19:12   #6
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forget the watcher
Quote:
Farmer Maggot ...
..he kept three huge dogs called Grip, Fang, and Wolf.
THIS is the real scandal. WHERE IS WOLF??
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Old July 20, 2021, 19:18   #7
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I'd like to see him (insert water discussion here) even without water implementation.

Not sure how I'd feel about him as a checkpoint unique. Would suck for the sneak-dive characters to run into a roadblock. Possibly if it was designed in such a way that you could sneak around (only 1 or 2 squares in melee range or tunnel through 10+ granite) to get to the only down stairs? Would need a fixed room design.
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Old July 20, 2021, 23:02   #8
Nick
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I'm pretty sure the Watcher is in ToME; I guess it would be at least as plausible mechanically as Wiruin. Maybe if we do put water in for 4.3 those two can be water-only monsters.

The anachronisms always used to annoy me, that's part of the reason I originally made FAangband and got rid of everything after the first age. It's also why I put the quote on the splashscreen, so it can be as if Morgoth has brought everyone back for the last battle

As far as specific anachronisms go, if we're assuming first age the balrog of Moria would be fine, as all the balrogs were around then and he appears in the third age because he's been sleeping. Old Man Willow is less certain, but he is meant to be, you know, old.
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Old July 21, 2021, 09:10   #9
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Yes, the Watcher is in ToME. In my variant, it looks like this:

Code:
name:The Watcher in the Water
base:aquatic
color:v
speed:120
hit-points:2700
hearing:30
armor-class:100
sleepiness:80
depth:45
rarity:3
weight:0
experience:12000
blow:CRUSH:ACID:8d8
blow:CRUSH:POISON:8d8
blow:CRUSH:PARALYZE:8d8
flags:UNIQUE | EVIL | COLD_BLOOD | PWMANG_BASE | PWMANG_FIXED
flags:DROP_4 | DROP_GOOD | DROP_GREAT | ONLY_ITEM
flags:IM_ACID | IM_COLD | IM_POIS
flags:NO_CONF | NO_FEAR
flags:FORCE_DEPTH | FORCE_SLEEP
spell-freq:5
innate-freq:29
spells:BA_WATE
spells:BO_WATE | BO_ICE
spells:BR_POIS | BR_WATE
spells:HOLD | TELE_TO
desc:A vile creature which seems to consist mostly of tentacles, it seeks to 
desc: drag people to their doom in the water. Few have ever escaped its grasp.
locations:The Small Water Cave
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Old July 21, 2021, 12:25   #10
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and in Tangaria it looks like this

Code:
name:The Watcher in the Water
base:aquatic
color:v
speed:120
hit-points:2700
hearing:30
armor-class:100
sleepiness:80
depth:45
rarity:3
weight:0
experience:17000
blow:CRUSH:ACID:8d8
blow:CRUSH:POISON:8d8
blow:CRUSH:PARALYZE:8d8
flags:UNIQUE | EVIL | COLD_BLOOD | PWMANG_BASE | PWMANG_FIXED
flags:DROP_4 | DROP_GOOD | DROP_GREAT | ONLY_ITEM
flags:IM_ACID | IM_COLD | IM_POIS
flags:NO_CONF | NO_FEAR
flags:FORCE_DEPTH | FORCE_SLEEP
spell-freq:3
spells:BO_WATE | BO_ICE
spells:HOLD | TELE_TO
friends:100:1d3:giant octopus:servant
friends:100:1d3:seahorse:servant
friends:100:1d3:giant squid:servant
friends:100:1d3:mermaid
desc:A vile creature which seems to consist mostly of tentacles, it seeks to 
desc: drag people to their doom in the water. Few have ever escaped its grasp.
locations:The Small Watery Cave
(rebalanced BR_ as it's instadeath if you not lucky)
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