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Old December 16, 2020, 20:47   #1
DavidMedley
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Druid: Friend of Beasts and Birds

I think a cool way to make Druid play very distinct is to give them a spell "Befriend Animal" (which really is "Banish Animal" but befriending it sounds so much nicer). Then make all their damage spells do half damage to animals, and all debuffs last half as long on animals. Could also have a higher level Mass Banish Animal (Mass Befriend doesn't sound right).

When I've played a Druid it feels a bit off that my character is especially good at killing animals. This way the Druid would be especially good at avoiding fights with animals. But when the Druid does want to fight an animal, it would be better to shape-shift into an animal and fight it out as nature intended, which I think would also be cool, thematic and fun.

The balance implications are hard to guess at without defining these befriend spells more fully, but it seems like it would be very beneficial on the whole. One interesting implication is that when Sauron shape-shifts he becomes an animal.
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Old December 16, 2020, 21:04   #2
DavidMedley
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There are a lot of animals, in case you are wondering, but they seem to thin out the deeper you go:
Code:
MariaDB [codexangband]> select name,glyph,rarity,depth from angband_420_monster where flags like "%ANIMAL%" order by cast(depth as signed);
+-----------------------------------+-------+--------+-------+
| name                              | glyph | rarity | depth |
+-----------------------------------+-------+--------+-------+
| scrawny cat                       | f     | 3      | 0     |
| scruffy little dog                | C     | 3      | 0     |
| wild dog                          | C     | 1      | 1     |
| fruit bat                         | b     | 1      | 1     |
| rock lizard                       | R     | 1      | 1     |
| soldier ant                       | a     | 1      | 1     |
| white worm mass                   | w     | 1      | 1     |
| giant white mouse                 | r     | 1      | 1     |
| large white snake                 | J     | 1      | 1     |
| giant white centipede             | c     | 1      | 1     |
| giant yellow centipede            | c     | 1      | 1     |
| crow                              | B     | 2      | 2     |
| wild cat                          | f     | 2      | 2     |
| blue yeek                         | y     | 1      | 2     |
| salamander                        | R     | 1      | 2     |
| cave spider                       | S     | 1      | 2     |
| white harpy                       | H     | 1      | 2     |
| giant black ant                   | a     | 1      | 2     |
| green worm mass                   | w     | 1      | 2     |
| giant green frog                  | R     | 1      | 2     |
| metallic green centipede          | c     | 1      | 2     |
| Fang, Farmer Maggot's Dog         | C     | 1      | 2     |
| Grip, Farmer Maggot's Dog         | C     | 1      | 2     |
| clear worm mass                   | w     | 2      | 3     |
| giant white ant                   | a     | 1      | 3     |
| yellow worm mass                  | w     | 2      | 3     |
| giant white louse                 | I     | 1      | 3     |
| metallic red centipede            | c     | 1      | 3     |
| metallic blue centipede           | c     | 1      | 3     |
| cave lizard                       | R     | 1      | 4     |
| silver mouse                      | r     | 1      | 4     |
| blue worm mass                    | w     | 1      | 4     |
| giant white rat                   | r     | 1      | 4     |
| large grey snake                  | J     | 1      | 4     |
| red worm mass                     | w     | 1      | 5     |
| copperhead snake                  | J     | 1      | 5     |
| giant green dragon fly            | F     | 2      | 5     |
| giant white dragon fly            | F     | 2      | 5     |
| rattlesnake                       | J     | 1      | 6     |
| giant brown bat                   | b     | 1      | 6     |
| giant gold dragon fly             | F     | 2      | 6     |
| giant black dragon fly            | F     | 2      | 6     |
| wood spider                       | S     | 3      | 7     |
| night lizard                      | R     | 2      | 7     |
| giant red frog                    | R     | 1      | 7     |
| crow of Durthang                  | B     | 3      | 7     |
| terrified yeek                    | y     | 1      | 8     |
| giant salamander                  | R     | 1      | 8     |
| yeti                              | Y     | 3      | 9     |
| cave bear                         | q     | 1      | 9     |
| king cobra                        | J     | 2      | 9     |
| black harpy                       | H     | 1      | 9     |
| giant red ant                     | a     | 2      | 9     |
| giant grey rat                    | r     | 1      | 9     |
| giant black louse                 | I     | 1      | 9     |
| wolf                              | C     | 1      | 10    |
| panther                           | f     | 2      | 10    |
| giant spider                      | S     | 2      | 10    |
| giant fruit fly                   | I     | 3      | 10    |
| giant white tick                  | S     | 2      | 10    |
| Orfax, Son of Boldor              | y     | 3      | 10    |
| hippogriff                        | H     | 1      | 11    |
| tiger                             | f     | 2      | 12    |
| white wolf                        | C     | 1      | 12    |
| black mamba                       | J     | 3      | 12    |
| master yeek                       | y     | 2      | 12    |
| stegocentipede                    | c     | 2      | 12    |
| nether worm mass                  | w     | 3      | 12    |
| killer brown beetle               | K     | 1      | 13    |
| Boldor, King of the Yeeks         | y     | 3      | 13    |
| warg                              | C     | 2      | 14    |
| giant flea                        | I     | 3      | 14    |
| griffon                           | H     | 1      | 15    |
| wererat                           | r     | 2      | 15    |
| dark hound                        | Z     | 3      | 15    |
| clear hound                       | Z     | 3      | 15    |
| light hound                       | Z     | 3      | 15    |
| giant tan bat                     | b     | 2      | 15    |
| giant tarantula                   | S     | 3      | 15    |
| giant clear centipede             | c     | 2      | 15    |
| craban                            | B     | 4      | 16    |
| umber hulk                        | X     | 1      | 16    |
| grizzly bear                      | q     | 2      | 16    |
| 2-headed hydra                    | M     | 2      | 17    |
| giant red scorpion                | S     | 1      | 17    |
| blink dog                         | C     | 2      | 18    |
| cold hound                        | Z     | 3      | 18    |
| fire hound                        | Z     | 3      | 18    |
| hummerhorn                        | I     | 4      | 18    |
| energy hound                      | Z     | 3      | 18    |
| werewolf                          | C     | 1      | 20    |
| air hound                         | Z     | 3      | 20    |
| sasquatch                         | Y     | 3      | 20    |
| earth hound                       | Z     | 3      | 20    |
| water hound                       | Z     | 3      | 20    |
| blood falcon                      | B     | 2      | 20    |
| 3-headed hydra                    | M     | 2      | 20    |
| Mirkwood spider                   | S     | 2      | 20    |
| sabre-tooth tiger                 | f     | 2      | 20    |
| blue dragon bat                   | b     | 1      | 21    |
| wyvern                            | d     | 2      | 22    |
| neekerbreeker                     | I     | 4      | 22    |
| killer stag beetle                | K     | 1      | 22    |
| giant yellow scorpion             | S     | 1      | 22    |
| phase spider                      | S     | 2      | 23    |
| red dragon bat                    | b     | 1      | 23    |
| giant silver ant                  | a     | 1      | 23    |
| werebear                          | q     | 2      | 24    |
| vampire bat                       | b     | 2      | 24    |
| 4-headed hydra                    | M     | 2      | 24    |
| carrion crawler                   | c     | 2      | 25    |
| killer red beetle                 | K     | 1      | 25    |
| giant firefly                     | I     | 4      | 26    |
| giant grey ant                    | a     | 1      | 26    |
| wolf chieftain                    | C     | 5      | 26    |
| abyss worm mass                   | w     | 3      | 26    |
| displacer beast                   | f     | 2      | 26    |
| giant fire tick                   | S     | 1      | 26    |
| disenchanter bat                  | b     | 4      | 26    |
| nexus hound                       | Z     | 4      | 27    |
| vibration hound                   | Z     | 4      | 27    |
| killer fire beetle                | K     | 1      | 27    |
| basilisk                          | R     | 3      | 28    |
| 5-headed hydra                    | M     | 2      | 28    |
| bat of Gorgoroth                  | b     | 3      | 28    |
| Beorn, the Mountain Bear          | q     | 0      | 28    |
| catoblepas                        | q     | 2      | 29    |
| purple worm                       | w     | 3      | 29    |
| giant black scorpion              | S     | 3      | 29    |
| giant army ant                    | a     | 3      | 30    |
| giant blue ant                    | a     | 2      | 30    |
| killer slicer beetle              | K     | 2      | 30    |
| death watch beetle                | K     | 3      | 31    |
| doombat                           | b     | 2      | 32    |
| serpent of the brownlands         | J     | 2      | 32    |
| mûmak                            | q     | 2      | 35    |
| wereworm                          | w     | 3      | 35    |
| impact hound                      | Z     | 4      | 35    |
| gravity hound                     | Z     | 4      | 35    |
| inertia hound                     | Z     | 4      | 35    |
| giant fire ant                    | a     | 1      | 35    |
| killer iridescent beetle          | K     | 2      | 37    |
| abyss spider                      | S     | 3      | 38    |
| 6-headed hydra                    | M     | 2      | 39    |
| giant roc                         | B     | 3      | 40    |
| 7-headed hydra                    | M     | 2      | 40    |
| disenchanter worm mass            | w     | 3      | 40    |
| hellhound                         | C     | 2      | 42    |
| The Queen Ant                     | a     | 2      | 42    |
| multi-hued hound                  | Z     | 6      | 43    |
| 8-headed hydra                    | M     | 2      | 44    |
| greater basilisk                  | R     | 2      | 45    |
| killer white beetle               | K     | 2      | 45    |
| winged horror                     | B     | 3      | 48    |
| ancient spider                    | S     | 5      | 48    |
| time hound                        | Z     | 4      | 51    |
| nether hound                      | Z     | 4      | 51    |
| plasma hound                      | Z     | 4      | 51    |
| The Phoenix                       | B     | 3      | 54    |
| dracolisk                         | D     | 2      | 55    |
| Shelob, Spider of Darkness        | S     | 3      | 55    |
| 9-headed hydra                    | M     | 2      | 57    |
| werewolf of Sauron                | C     | 2      | 63    |
| spider of Gorgoroth               | S     | 3      | 63    |
| chaos hound                       | Z     | 4      | 64    |
| Tevildo, Prince of Cats           | f     | 3      | 66    |
| jabberwock                        | H     | 3      | 68    |
| nightcrawler                      | J     | 3      | 69    |
| hound of Tindalos                 | Z     | 5      | 69    |
| aether hound                      | Z     | 5      | 74    |
| Ungoliant, the Unlight            | S     | 1      | 75    |
| serpent of chaos                  | J     | 3      | 78    |
| Draugluin, Sire of All Werewolves | C     | 2      | 83    |
| The Tarrasque                     | R     | 2      | 86    |
| Huan, Wolfhound of the Valar      | C     | 1      | 90    |
| Carcharoth, the Jaws of Thirst    | C     | 1      | 90    |
| Wolf-Sauron                       | C     | 0      | 99    |
| Serpent-Sauron                    | J     | 0      | 99    |
+-----------------------------------+-------+--------+-------+
178 rows in set (0.002 sec)
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Old December 17, 2020, 14:54   #3
Estie
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Time hounds are just playing...
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Old December 17, 2020, 15:01   #4
Pete Mack
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Hounds of Tindalos really should be Evil, and probably have dark aura, as smoke emerges from the walls... (Yikes!)
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Old April 7, 2021, 23:07   #5
DavidMedley
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidMedley View Post
I think a cool way to make Druid play very distinct is to give them a spell "Befriend Animal" (which really is "Banish Animal" but befriending it sounds so much nicer). Then make all their damage spells do half damage to animals, and all debuffs last half as long on animals.
I didn't want to bring this up again during the finalization of 4.2.2, but I think it's a really good idea. Anyone else love/hate it?
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Old April 7, 2021, 23:24   #6
Cuboideb
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It could be a timed effect. The player is ignored by animals and swap position with them.

If damage is halved the befriend spell should be in the first book.
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Old April 8, 2021, 00:30   #7
DavidMedley
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Oh, I meant "after adding this banish spell, change all the druid spells to half effect vs animals." A lot of them are double effect right now.
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Old April 8, 2021, 05:30   #8
will_asher
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Why change spells to half effect? There's nothing wrong with having a 'friend to animals' putting hostile animals to sleep or slowing/confusing them. Reducing the effect of damaging spells to animals might be appropriate though.

That said, I do like the idea of a timed effect to make animals ignore the player as a druid (and be able to swap places with them).
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Old April 8, 2021, 12:50   #9
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While the effect is active, animals should not be damaged by the player. To avoid exploits against the most powerful animals.
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Old April 8, 2021, 23:47   #10
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To me, the best way to eliminate exploiting animals is to give a very effective banish animal spell. It's a draw; you don't get XP or treasure from them, and they can no longer help or harm you.
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