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Old November 16, 2019, 04:24   #11
wizard44
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Thank you for the tips everyone. Complied with the pacifist suggestion. As predicted, however, the character met a quick death at the hands of a group of orcs at 150 ft.

YASD #2: The worst stealth/luck in the history of existence.

After some research and looking at previous pacifist runs, I gave myself 7 stealth points, 3 perception, and gave myself the Keen Senses and Disguise skills. Unfortunately, the rooms on the first level were filled with orcs, and despite my attempts to sneak by everybody, an orc notices me and I get nearly get killed by it. I manage to kill it and find the downstairs and immediately descend, as an orc scout notices me and pursues me. A grimhawk notices me, forcing me to go back upstairs, where I get leather armor, a longsword, and a pair of boots. I then head back down to 100 feet, where an orc notices me and begins a through chase through the level, where I barely reach a downstairs staircase to 150 feet. An orc scout quickly screwed up the fun and forced me back up to 100 feet, where I get a cloak, a shortbow and a set of special arrows that turned out to be poisoned arrows upon testing on an orc scout. After retreating back to 150 feet, I find a sky blue potion and get noticed by an orc, who alerts his buddies and starts a chase that kills me before I can escape back up the stairs, due to serious bad luck with an orc occupying the staircase and cutting me off, forcing me to go on a very desperate chase for the downstairs. Fate has truly dealt me a cruel hand with that character and given me an embarrassing loss.

And now we move on to the third of my four attempts with this game.

Complete N00b's Journey: Character #3

The random generator gives me Ragorlin, a Male Noldor from the house of Finarfin. The random generator was a tad cruel by not giving me any boosts to strength.

I'm guessing because of the 0 strength, the plan is to select a non-melee build? Which build would be the best?

The starting details for this character are at the following ladder link:
http://angband.oook.cz/ladder-show.php?id=22972

Any tips for this character is appreciated, but I don't think the character reaches 250 feet.

EDIT: Upon further reflection, it seems that Basil's stealth singer build might be the best build to go for this character (the start involves adding 8 perception points, then getting Keen Senses and Listen and dump the rest on stealth points). I still will probably die before I can get the song of silence if I follow this path, but I honestly don't have any better ideas on how to distribute exp.

Last edited by wizard44; November 16, 2019 at 06:51.
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Old November 16, 2019, 09:12   #12
DrWho42
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i would dig seeing videos of the n00b's playthrough
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Old November 16, 2019, 14:04   #13
Pete Mack
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Bad strength isn't fatal to melee builds, the way bad dex or con is. I am no Sil expert, but the ladder hs a number of reasonably successful examples. E.g:
http://angband.oook.cz/ladder-show.php?id=22913
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Old November 16, 2019, 15:02   #14
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Solid starting stats for a pacifist build. Here's one I won with:
http://angband.oook.cz/ladder-show.php?id=21310

It's easier if you aren't actually committed to pacifist of course, you do have some shot at killing birds and other perils that can cut pacifist runs short very early on.

I wrote up a bit of an after action report / pacifist guide here:
http://angband.oook.cz/forum/showthread.php?t=8757
however, be warned that pacifists are very squishy, I lost many before getting a win. You need to get quite a strong feel for the stealth mechanics to do well with them, and get used to avoiding situations and backing off to the stairs.

Assuming you're looking for a win rather than a pacifist victory, I would recommend picking up a bow early on at the very least so you can take down birds and other low HP fast moving targets which can mess up your game; an assassin approach with Assassination, Finesse and Subtlety should also work well but be aware such builds often founder when they bite off more than they can chew.

You don't want more Evasion than you need to get Sprinting, IMO, Stealth is your main investment for much of the early game. Later you will want lots and lots of Song, Lorien at high Song is almost game breaking.

Subtlety based builds want a good shortsword, ideally 1lb 1d8, or artifact dagger with sharpness. They don't need much strength at all. Original Sil deathblades are better still if you can manage 2 strength, but acquiring them is hazardous for a stealthy character with little evasion.

Last edited by Quirk; November 16, 2019 at 15:16.
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Old November 16, 2019, 19:33   #15
wobbly
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That's actually my preferred stat layout for a pacifist. Quirk gave one of his with Elbereth & here's one of mine that used a staff of slumber instead:

http://angband.oook.cz/ladder-show.php?id=18794

You'll see the start is like Basil's except I took no starting stealth preferring to have dodging in case a wolf noticed me, the way they dart in & out gives you some lee-way to back away & close a door if your evasion is high enough.

There's some other things that'll work such as singers & assassins. Grace 6 is beautiful on a singer & an assassin can eventually do damage with no str, though they are hard to get right. Your judgement on what you can & can't kill on an assassin needs to be spot on.

Pete Mack mentioned melee & str 0 is certainly do-able just harder. Early on you need a 2-hander to be doing damage & when you compare: A glaive w/ str 0 is 2d9, a longsword with str 3 is 2d8. So you're like a more normal warrior minus a shield, its harder. However by endgame you have enough melee to work with a light weapon & subtlety when they come in to their own. Basically a hard start that gets strong late game.
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Old November 17, 2019, 00:25   #16
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Thank you everyone for your posts.

I decided to stick with Basil’s Stealth Singer, since the build actually has a template on what tactics to follow. I felt that the listen skill was worth trying at the start to see if I can at least get some basic progress. I am relatively proud to say that the character DID make it to 250 feet, which means that the Ragorlin is now worthy of having an exclusive thread! Check it out below.

http://angband.oook.cz/forum/showthread.php?t=9674
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Old November 17, 2019, 21:22   #17
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Well, a group of crebain manages to screw up Ragorlin’s promising progress by noticing, surrounding, and killing the character. After cursing my luck at not being able to evade the crebain before that happened, I move on to randomly generating the final character.

Complete N00b's Journey: Character #4

The RNG is relentless in giving me a raw deal, as it gives me Embar, a Male Edain from the house of Beor. The stat generation isn’t too good either. But hey, life gives you horrible situations more often than not, so you gotta make the best of it.

So what’s the best build for this character? Should I go for the pacifist route again? Or go for something like clouded’s Edain Hador build according to the video of silstreamer. The latter involves giving the character 8 melee and 8 evasion points, then 3 perception points to prepare for Keen Senses.

Of course, I don’t imagine the character getting to 250 ft, which is the first goal for this character to achieve. Upon the death of this character, my journey will come to an end and I will post my overall experience of the game in this thread, which some may call a review.


The starting details have been posted to the following Angband ladder link below:
http://angband.oook.cz/ladder-show.php?id=22979

As always, feel free to offer any input for this character.
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Old November 17, 2019, 21:41   #18
Pete Mack
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If this really is your last try, why not use a non-random character? 1233 is pretty much blah across the board, though possibly sybtlety? But 1332 would be easier for that, as it cuts your melee and evasion costs in half.
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Old November 17, 2019, 23:54   #19
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@Wizard44

You should play at angband.live. Maybe after this 4th one, start playing over there live so some of our Sil colleagues can help out
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Old November 18, 2019, 00:41   #20
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Yeah, I feel your randomisation has led to a very non-standard way to play the game: twice picking the highest difficulty options and making them much harder by pushing them out of the most playable band of stats.

I hope you've managed to enjoy yourself anyway, though I can't help but think that your approach is liable to prove quite frustrating over time. Sil is not an easy game and new players are liable to find themselves with quite a steep learning curve even when starting with a melee Noldor.
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