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Old April 19, 2019, 01:37   #21
Estie
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Quote:
What sort of rings of the Mouse should I look for if I do decide to get one?
Rings of mouse come with a damage penalty and a dex and stealth bonus.

The reason to use them is the stealth bonus. If melee is a consideration, they are usually not worthwhile; if the damage penalty is low and the dex bonus high, the melee damage output might not suffer, especially with a branded weapon, but that is rare.

Since for you melee damage is of almost no concern at this stage, you might as well ruin it completely to get stealth. Defender weapon, the ultimate stat stick, would serve the same purpose.
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Old April 19, 2019, 10:57   #22
wizard44
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The answer is no Pete Mack. I got gypped pretty hard when it came to bows and weapons. Duntir is in okay shape, as he got his two points of strength and quite a few items from stairscumming the heck out of D:40 and so.

Complete N00b’s Journey: Part 5-5

I recalled back to D:32 and kill a pack of white wolves and a shimmering mold to get to level 25. I then learned the Reveal Monsters and the Acid Bolt spell in the toolbox. I then kill a pack of ice trolls at the expense of quite a few arrows and a couple of curing potions of all kinds. I then kill a quasit, a cold vortex, and a pack of giant blue ants and pick up a Potion of Healing. After killing a grave wight while getting experience-drained, I then find the stairs to D:33 and descend, where I find and read-id a scroll of Mass Banishment and get a spare wand of Teleport Other. I then kill a hill giant and get a Rod of Fire Bolts, which I keep for the time being. I then kill a young green dragon and get to D:34, where I dispatch a ring mimic and a young black dragon before doing down to D:35, where I kill Orfax, Son of Boldor, an ogre chieftain, and Orfax’s yeek retinue to pick up a Large Metal Shield of Resistance, the Spear ‘Nimloth’ (1d6) (+11, +13) <+3 Stealth, +3 Speed>, and better Ring of Ice [+12] before I descend due to a horde of mumakil coming my way. I run smack dab into Beorn, the shape changer, prompting me to reload the level by stairdancing. Once there, I read-id a scroll of Teleport Level that sends me back to D:35 and forces me to descend to D:36 again. In that level, I quickly find the stairs to D:37 and descend, where I get a ring of Intelligence and descend again to D:38, as Mim and his sons were very close by.

D:38 was host to a knights Templars and patriarchs, so I reloaded the level and killed a mage and an Easterling Champion to get better Wooden Sandals [1, +6]. I then kill an olog and trip an alarm, prompting me to reload the level again after waking up plenty of dangerous creatures nearby. In the new level, I find and quaff a Potion of Dexterity before I find the downstairs and descend to D:39 to escape a vault full of beholders. D:39 had a banshee that scared me, so I ascend back up to D:38, where I kill a shimmering mold and a young gold dragon to get to level 26. I also use-id a rod of Hold monster and drop it and face down a spectre, who drops a Potion of Wisdom upon death, which I drink. I then descend and kill a bunch of ghouls and a nexus vortex and get a ring of bodykeeping and quickly descend to D:40, where I meet Khim, Son of Mim and retreat back up to D:39, where I kill a shardstorm and teleport away a mystic and quaff-id a potion of enlightenment. I then kill a plasma vortex, an energy vortex, two barrow wights, and a group of giant fire ants. I then face a young black dragon and have my gloves of Free Action damaged and find a potion that was one of Resist Poison when quaffed. I then descend back to D:40, where I kill four phase spiders and find Iron Shod Boots of Free Action [4, +6]. I then kill a black knight and a ranger and find the stairs to D:41, which I take. I teleport away a master vampire and a storm giant on D:41 before finding nothing nearby of note and beginning a tighter cycle of stairdancing. The cycle eventually gets me to level 28, and grants me 2 Potions of Wisdom that I quaff, a Potion of Constitution that I quaff, a Potion of Dexterity that I quaff, a Ring of Strength <+4>, a potion of Nimbleness that grants me dexterity at the cost of wisdom, a better ring of Damage (+0, +11), a Fur Cloack of Stealth [3, +6] <+3 Stealth>, a Potion of Toughness that grants me constitution at the cost of dexterity, a Potion of Brawn that grants me strength at the cost of wisdom, and a Potion of Intelligence, which I quaff, the set of Guantlets ‘Pauraegen’ [3, +14] <+1 light>, a Staff of Speed, and a Potion of Strength, which I quaff while taking out Shagrat the Orc Captain along the way. After running out of arrows, I finally decide to Recall back to Town. Once back, I deposit my gloves of Free Action, my potions of Speed, and my scrolls of Satisfy Hunger and buy 5 Potions of Restore Life Levels and stash them as well. I also buy 3 Scrolls of Word of Recall, 7 scrolls of phase door, 80 standard arrows, 4 Potions of Heroism, a Potion of Cure Serious Wounds, and 4 Potions of Cure Critical Wounds. I then buff up 40 of my arrows with Scrolls of Enchant Weapon To-Dam and buy 20 Potions of Cure Light Wounds. Still no better bow in the stores however. Sigh.

So the next goal is to get to D:43, and try to get two more increases to the strength score, as it’s still pretty pathetic at this point. If I’m looking for potions of Strength or Augmentation, levels at ~D:40 are generally the way to go right?

Duntir’s status has been updated, and I would appreciate any input or tips for this character at this point.
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Old April 19, 2019, 13:06   #23
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!Augmentation has native D:40, so if you can survive at that depth by all means do it. (In general, "go as deep as you can without taking crazy risks and burning through too many consumables" is good advice that applies throughout the game...)
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Old April 19, 2019, 13:40   #24
Estie
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The importance of strength early on comes from providing carrying capacity and melee damage. The reason carrying capacity is so important is that without it, you drop to negative speed which means you always have to account for double moves by the monsters.

Speed is the important stat here, not strength per se and once you have an item that grants a little speed like your spear, this aspect of strength becomes completely irrelevant. A little positve speed doesnt really enable you to calculate your double moves to avoid taking damage, like +10 speed does, but it makes you safe from double move by base speed monsters. So it doesnt matter much if that is +1 or +2 speed; the big step is going from -1 to 0.

At your stage, melee damage is the only positive effect of more strength; of course you still want it, but it is now low on the list - your glaring weakness is your bow.

The "cursed" dagger was actually of slay dragon ? Weird that you couldnt sell it, I dont understand what is going on there.
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Old April 20, 2019, 09:10   #25
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Thanks for the input you guys. So Duntir has actually surpassed this goal by a lot and covered his key weaknesses and reached to D:51.

Complete N00b’s Journey: Part 5-6

So I recall to D:42, where I find a rod of Teleport Other before descending to D:43. After some reloading through the stairdance tactic, I quaff a found potion of enlightenment and find and quaff a Potion of Constitution, 2 Potions of Strength, find a Hard Leather Cap of Telepathy, and get to level 29 from some kills. I then stairdance and kill Draebor, the Imp, who drops a pair of Leather Sandals of Speed [1,+7] <+5> and a scroll of Banishment. I run into Adunaphael the Quiet on D:44, who gets teleported away, and proceed to descend to D:45, where I begin a careful descent down while searching for a source of poison resistance and a better bow. D:45 had 2 Potions of Intelligence and a Potion of Strength that I quaffed after killing a small group of baby, young, and mature black dragons. I also find a Mithril shield [16, +15] and a Long Bow of Power (x3) (+8, +15), which covered my key weakness with my bow. I also find mithril gauntlets of free action [6, +7], allowing me to drop my boots of free action in favor of the Sandals of Speed. I then proceed to go to D:46, after getting level drained by a vampire lord and kill Bill, Bert, and Tom the stone troll trio. The only useful drop was a studded Leather Armour of Elvenkind, which allowed me to have source of Poison resistance on demand. I then go to D:47, where I find the pair of Leather boots of Radagast [2, +12] and get level drained from a death mold summoned from a use-id’d staff of summoning. I quickly descend to D:48 and reload the level to avoid running into uniques upon entry. Upon finding a suitable level, I kill Nar the Dwarf, who drops a useless cursed lead-filled mace. I then head to D:49, where I find another staff of speed, a Potion of Intelligence which I quaff, and a better Amulet of Infravision <+3>. I descend to D:50 where I get to level 30 by selectively killing lesser dragons and descend to D:51, where I find nothing of interest and go to D:51, where my pack finally fills up with artifacts and must keep items (with the last one being a rod of magic mapping) and prompts me to do a recall back up to town. Once there, I deposit my potions of Healing, Restore Life levels, and Speed at my home, and buy a Wand of Drain Life and get more potions of Cure Serious Wounds and Cure Critical Wounds. I then get enough standard arrows to bring the total number of missiles to 80 and end the part.

So the next goal is to reach D:58 and find a source of chaos resistance, with the secondary goal being trying to find better sources of Poison resistance and a source of hold life.

Are there any non-artifacts that provide chaos resistance, or do I have to just get lucky with finding those?

Which is better to have for a helmet: The artifact iron helmet or the helmet of Telepathy? And which armor choices do you guys think is the most optimal for me to war at this point? Specifically, which combination of gloves, armor and boots should I wear for a trek down to D:58?

Duntir’s newest status has been updated in the ladder, and any answers and comments to promote Duntir’s survival are welcome!
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Old April 20, 2019, 11:26   #26
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Helmet: tough choice but I'd go with telepathy, and carry the other around as a swap for pConf. Knowing where monsters are at all times is game-changing, for me.
Boots: definitely go for the speed ones and try to juggle your kit around to make room for those. You haven't found an amulet of free action? Once you have SI and the phial, infravision is basically useless; it would be better to try to move FA to the amulet slot for now and wear Paurhach for the regeneration. Or at least an amulet of regeneration.
Armor: another tough choice. 4.1.3 already has the cone breath change, right? In that case the usefulness of rPoison is lower. Do you melee a lot? Try the Elvenkind one, and if you feel too underpowered in melee (both in terms of damage output and defence/AC) then switch back.
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Old April 20, 2019, 11:42   #27
Grotug
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All pieces of Elvenkind equipment have one high resistance, and thus have a chance of having Chaos resistance. Aman cloaks also always have either one high resistance or a protection of some kind. Blades of Chaos also have chaos resistance. I think those are the only three things that can have chaos resistance. Although maybe any high-end ego weapon could have it?
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Old April 20, 2019, 12:39   #28
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The obvious 1 missing from Grotug's list is Chaos dragon Scale Mail though you'd probably want to keep your artifact armour unless it was a nice ego.

I'd wear the telepathy helm. I'm struggling to think of anything invisible that doesn't get picked up by telepathy. Qs show to infravision. Perhaps lurkers don't get picked up but you have FA.
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Old April 20, 2019, 17:05   #29
Estie
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That elven armor is pure gold; all relevant raistances covered in one slot and stealth to boot. I would dump Arvedui. Your shield slot is free for anything useful you might find. By the time you want to replace your elvenkind, you are looking for con, not str. With it and the ESP hat, you are ready to go down all the way.
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Old April 20, 2019, 17:17   #30
Pete Mack
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You're in good shape. RPoison is definitely worth a couple points of STR. It is surprising that no dungeon books have sho mwn up. They make a huge difference. Nice that you found a decent bow. You'll find better soon enough
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