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Old February 17, 2010, 00:21   #21
Hariolor
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One big difference with O-combat that no-one has mentioned is that everyone gets at least two blows. This evens things out a lot in the early game.
It certainly does!

As do special attacks/abilities (shield bash anyone?), and the AC bonus from polearms - while not perfect, O combat makes V pale by comparison...

...not that that'll keep me from playing V as well...

In fact, I'd suggest anyone who proposes changes to the V system learn how O does it first (other variants may be similar), and then use *that* as a springboard for rehashing V.
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Old February 17, 2010, 02:16   #22
Derakon
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I think O is a bit too radical, personally. Particularly the "deadliness" percentages are rather opaque. V's system has the overwhelming advantage of easy-to-calculate damage. It's very obvious how two different weapons compare and what you can do to increase your damage. O is nice, yes, but I don't think it should be imported into V.
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Old February 17, 2010, 13:18   #23
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Originally Posted by Derakon View Post
If you want to smooth out the blows continuum, then instead of having a random chance of getting an extra blow, you should make each blow take a set amount of energy, which decreases as your STR/DEX/level/whatever increases. The current system charges you 100, 50, 33, 25, 20, etc energy per blow, depending on how many attacks per round you get. A "smoother" system would be able to charge any amount of energy, eliminating those huge steps. From a usability standpoint, each time you attack you could perform as many attacks as possible without costing more than 100 energy; or you could just do each attack one at a time (which in my experience isn't nearly so bad as it sounds).
This is exactly my proposal for "fractional" blows - a smooth progression of decreasing energy-per-blow cost. See ticket #987 on trac.rephial.org.
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Old February 17, 2010, 13:48   #24
Xaxyx
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Steadily decreasing cost per blow does seem like an apt solution. It also mimics the current implementation of the ranged attack rate for Rangers (which also could be made to be a smooth curve, rather than the current step pattern at 20 and 40).
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Old February 17, 2010, 18:10   #25
Colbey
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I really like the idea of DEX only increasing blows for particularly light weapons, and STR only affecting blows for heavy ones (where "light" and "heavy" are of course relative to various things).
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Old February 17, 2010, 19:24   #26
Donald Jonker
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Another remedy might be to give high STR chars a hefty +to_hit bonus with heavy weapons (maybe eventually reaching 0% miss?). That, with a heavy weapon damage buff could make up some difference. It also makes more intuitive/thematic sense than giving more blows/round.

Part of the reason I always go for more blows is that you're much more likely to hit something with more iterations.
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Old February 17, 2010, 19:34   #27
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Originally Posted by Donald Jonker View Post
Another remedy might be to give high STR chars a hefty +to_hit bonus with heavy weapons (maybe eventually reaching 0% miss?). That, with a heavy weapon damage buff could make up some difference. It also makes more intuitive/thematic sense than giving more blows/round.

Part of the reason I always go for more blows is that you're much more likely to hit something with more iterations.
While I don't disagree with your challenge to the D&D hangover of 5% min miss chance, I don't think pure STR should achieve better. Very strong people can be hopelessly inaccurate - personally I think there should be quite a low cap on +to_hit from STR - something like weapon weight / 2 or so.

I do think that STR should be more important in the calculation of energy-per-blow for heavy weapons. I'm working on a formula for energy per blow which I hope to post for comments soon.
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