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Old May 7, 2011, 05:40   #11
scud
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My high elf ranger (*snore*) has recently taken down Uriel with a lot of help from a) being in a cavern level (phase doored, dug in and rested half a dozen times) and b) carrying Firestar in his back pocket.

That was at 3650', CL45, 6.5m exp and nearly 600k turns. Looking at my Hall of Fame this is very rapid progress for me, but I reckon I've got at least another 600k turns before I can even consider taking on the Big Man himself.

Have had two attempts at Gabriel but had to bail out very quickly on each occasion. Still haven't seen Azriel. The three Big Angels are to my mind both OOD and undervalued: Uriel is 33k (to my CL46), Gabriel is 48k, Azriel is in the middle. Compare that to the Witch-King, who is basically a 'basher' but is worth 104k. I'd definitely rate Azriel and Gabriel as being in the Top Ten uniques.

Obviously we all have different definitions of 'end game', but I know that once I'm capable of dealing with Azriel and Gabriel I then have a 'viable' character that, with some equipment enhancements and a house full of potions, should be capable of meeting Morgy.
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Old May 7, 2011, 06:29   #12
Tregonsee
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Derakon View Post
Yes. The only classes that can achieve 0% failure rates are mages and priests. Everyone else has a minimum of 5% (or 100%, in the warrior's case...).
Do Paladins have other restrictions for gains in wisdom (mana points, spells gained, etc)?

I realize they do not get all spells, and that mana costs per spell are higher
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Old May 7, 2011, 07:08   #13
PowerDiver
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Originally Posted by Tregonsee View Post
Do Paladins have other restrictions for gains in wisdom (mana points, spells gained, etc)?

I realize they do not get all spells, and that mana costs per spell are higher
Not a restriction, but the one other difference is less damage from orbs given a particular CL.
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Old May 7, 2011, 13:52   #14
ulrichvonbek
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Quote:
Obviously we all have different definitions of 'end game', but I know that once I'm capable of dealing with Azriel and Gabriel I then have a 'viable' character that, with some equipment enhancements and a house full of potions, should be capable of meeting Morgy.
I used being able to kill the Tarasque as a similar gauge of power recently. I really needed a few more ?Banish before the final fight though. Luckily got through it relying on banish evil when the summons weren't that dangerous.
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Old May 7, 2011, 14:46   #15
Tregonsee
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So a Paladin and a Priest will get the same benefit in terms of mana points and spells available per point of Wisdom...
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Old May 8, 2011, 00:35   #16
EpicMan
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Also the Paladin gets all the spells a priest does
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Old May 8, 2011, 01:25   #17
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No, they don't. Paladins don't get the 1000HP heal, for example. I don't think they get Rune of Protection either, though it's been awhile since I played one.
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Old May 8, 2011, 03:12   #18
will_asher
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tregonsee View Post
So a Paladin and a Priest will get the same benefit in terms of mana points and spells available per point of Wisdom...
Except that mana points are also based on the level that the class can learn its first spell. IIRC, a V paladin gets his first spell at ~clevel4, so he does get less mana, (but not by very much).
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Old May 8, 2011, 04:59   #19
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And of course, a point of mana goes a lot further for a priest than for a paladin, because his spells are all a lot cheaper.
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Old May 8, 2011, 23:10   #20
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Early game is buying starting gear.
Mid game is playing your character.
Late game is looking at your tombstone.
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