Angband.oook.cz
Angband.oook.cz
AboutVariantsLadderForumCompetitionComicScreenshotsFunniesLinks

Go Back   Angband Forums > Angband > Vanilla

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old December 16, 2016, 11:37   #31
AmyBSOD
Rookie
 
AmyBSOD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Gehennom
Posts: 13
AmyBSOD is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by droof View Post
Since ToME2 development has stopped a couple of years ago,
There are several actively developed ToME2 branches, including ToME2-ah by AnonymousHero, and ToME-SX by myself. You might want to check them out.
__________________
Author of Angband variant ToME-SX (based on ToME 2.3.5): https://github.com/AmyBSOD/ToME-SX - it's very sexy!
AmyBSOD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 16, 2016, 13:04   #32
PowerWyrm
Prophet
 
PowerWyrm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 2,672
PowerWyrm is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnonymousHero View Post
I can only recall two exceptions, namely the semi-recent removal of all traps (uninteresting mechanic) and the removal of Alchemy (hopelessly broken).
Alchemy in ToME is not broken, it's simply bugged. Whenever you create an artifact, you spend points to add abilities, which require more and more points to add them. Unless you're willing to spend ages scumming for those points, they will be limited, so you'll get a perfectly balanced artifact. The only problem is... the best abilities (extra attacks on weapons and extra mana capacity on staves) cost ZERO points to add, so you can add them indefinitely and get an artifact with +65535 attacks or +65535% mana capacity. Fix that, and you basically un-broke Alchemy.
__________________
PWMAngband variant maintainer - check http://powerwyrm.monsite-orange.fr (or http://www.mangband.org/forum/viewforum.php?f=9) to learn more about this new variant!
PowerWyrm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 16, 2016, 16:50   #33
Derakon
Prophet
 
Derakon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 8,951
Derakon is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by PowerWyrm View Post
Alchemy in ToME is not broken, it's simply bugged. Whenever you create an artifact, you spend points to add abilities, which require more and more points to add them. Unless you're willing to spend ages scumming for those points, they will be limited, so you'll get a perfectly balanced artifact. The only problem is... the best abilities (extra attacks on weapons and extra mana capacity on staves) cost ZERO points to add, so you can add them indefinitely and get an artifact with +65535 attacks or +65535% mana capacity. Fix that, and you basically un-broke Alchemy.
The inherent problem of "grind to make awesome gear" still remains. Alchemy needs to not have artifact creation, at bare minimum, before it's a reasonable concept.
Derakon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 16, 2016, 17:41   #34
AnonymousHero
Veteran
 
AnonymousHero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,367
AnonymousHero is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mondkalb View Post
I like the wilderness levels in Faangband very much (maybe even more in the current default condensed version) and I think they are quite thematic..
I don't actually have anything against the levels per se, it's just that it doesn't really feel like a wilderness -- I get this feeling of "claustropobia" or having guard rails in that you're basically forced to use exactly the exits (i.e. "<" or ">") that are provided inside the level rather than just walking off the edge of the map.
AnonymousHero is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 16, 2016, 19:59   #35
Mondkalb
Knight
 
Mondkalb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 939
Mondkalb is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnonymousHero View Post
I don't actually have anything against the levels per se, it's just that it doesn't really feel like a wilderness -- I get this feeling of "claustropobia" or having guard rails in that you're basically forced to use exactly the exits (i.e. "<" or ">") that are provided inside the level rather than just walking off the edge of the map.
I don't know whether that would be possible with the engine.
At least the exits are usually on roads, so one could argue that they are like pathways through the landscape and the permanent walls symbolize unsurmountable natural obstacles.
Mondkalb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 16, 2016, 20:19   #36
AnonymousHero
Veteran
 
AnonymousHero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,367
AnonymousHero is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mondkalb View Post
I don't know whether that would be possible with the engine.
At least the exits are usually on roads, so one could argue that they are like pathways through the landscape and the permanent walls symbolize unsurmountable natural obstacles.
Right, it's definitely defensible as a game mechanic, it just feels wrong to me. :shrug:

(EDIT: Hah, had a shug unicode emoji thing there at the end. Turns out it works fine when you post, but doesn't work when editing the post.)
AnonymousHero is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 16, 2016, 21:13   #37
Nick
Vanilla maintainer
 
Nick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Canberra, Australia
Age: 54
Posts: 7,865
Donated: $60
Nick will become famous soon enough
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnonymousHero View Post
I don't actually have anything against the levels per se, it's just that it doesn't really feel like a wilderness -- I get this feeling of "claustropobia" or having guard rails in that you're basically forced to use exactly the exits (i.e. "<" or ">") that are provided inside the level rather than just walking off the edge of the map.
What you want is Beleriand wilderness, then
__________________
One for the Dark Lord on his dark throne
In the Land of Mordor where the Shadows lie.
Nick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 16, 2016, 21:56   #38
AnonymousHero
Veteran
 
AnonymousHero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,367
AnonymousHero is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick View Post
What you want is Beleriand wilderness, then
It seemed really interesting -- and, in fact IIRC, similar to how T2 does it[1] -- are you still working on it?

[1] You were using fractal generation, right?
AnonymousHero is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 16, 2016, 22:18   #39
Nick
Vanilla maintainer
 
Nick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Canberra, Australia
Age: 54
Posts: 7,865
Donated: $60
Nick will become famous soon enough
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnonymousHero View Post
It seemed really interesting -- and, in fact IIRC, similar to how T2 does it[1] -- are you still working on it?

[1] You were using fractal generation, right?
I was basically using similar methods to the FA wilderness, but without the borders - the entire Beleriand map was split into little chunks (this is a rough idea). Also there was no zoomed overworld map, so the plan was to have other means of speeding long-distance travel.

I have not worked on it since taking over as V maintainer - hence my occasional comments about who might want to take over that task at some point
__________________
One for the Dark Lord on his dark throne
In the Land of Mordor where the Shadows lie.
Nick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 16, 2016, 23:33   #40
droof
Apprentice
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 71
droof is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnonymousHero View Post
It's ambling along very slowly, but it's not quite dead yet. Whether you regard my fork as "legitimate" is up to you.
Nice! I played that version from day one. Checked out the master and built it, because tome2/tome2 sounded legit. I didn't know it wasn't legit. Or it is. I don't know, but I'm really enjoying your version, thank you!

Quote:
Originally Posted by AmyBSOD View Post
There are several actively developed ToME2 branches, including ToME2-ah by AnonymousHero, and ToME-SX by myself. You might want to check them out.
So that's what -ah stands for. I'll try the SX version some time later as well.

Is the first ToME2 town supposed to be all dark when coming back up from the first dungeon at night? It's hard to navigate the town like that. I just sleep a couple of thousand turns and wait for daylight before moving around again.

Googling Beleriand, I found the git and checked it out. I guess from that project and FAangband that Nick is the Wilderness expert here? Not trying to flatter, just checking out massive project resources like region.txt and FA.

I like the larger world idea from ToME mostly because of the starting parchment telling me my current and next options and what to look forward to in which directions. I don't know the world yet, but I want to make that journey. Also the first town and dungeon environments look colorful in ASCII unlike traditional black & white like rogue / moria / angband / nethack. I hope I'll see other themes in other regions. Really every Angband variant I've tried so far does theming, only vanilla Angband stays conservative with its terrain as far as I've made it. I suppose that's because it has a large committee to answer to and variants can be opinionated?

So an overworld wilderness is not for Angband, the game being a linear dungeon dive experience. And being great at it. Maybe instead a FAangband-style closed "wilderness dungeon level" at some point could work as some of the 100 Angband levels without changing its core gameplay, but that's probably already been thought of.

Being a roguelike maintainer must take a lot of effort, where do you find the time for such a spare time commitment?
droof is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Birth option - monsters learn from their mistakes? Wanderlust Vanilla 5 January 12, 2016 09:03
Oafmatch, an RPG with an optional roguelike dungeon Susramanian Idle chatter 2 October 25, 2015 00:32
Sauron optional? Zikke Vanilla 14 May 5, 2010 00:20
Confused about birth option g. rodrigues Vanilla 1 February 28, 2008 03:28
[svn] Roguelike keyset is a birth option now? ekolis Vanilla 1 September 15, 2007 05:24


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 06:39.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions Inc.