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Old October 31, 2014, 17:30   #11
Derakon
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Originally Posted by EpicMan View Post
So the "Dying" status mostly just means that regeneration and healing are both disabled. Is mana regeneration disabled as well?
Honestly I hadn't thought about it. Is mana regeneration likely to be relevant on the timescales this status effect is likely to occupy? I guess we could just turn it off too for consistency.

Estie's proposal to have it only apply when you're at at least 50% is reasonable. I expect that if this change were actually to be implemented, it would probably need a number of tweaks to make certain it plays well and is understandable to players.

We could also do things like have a near-brush with death permanently damage your CON. Mostly for flavor reasons, but why not?
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Old November 1, 2014, 03:23   #12
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I think that this is a newbie training idea, because experienced players shouldn't need to coddled like this.

With that in mind, maybe it should only apply for attacks that exceed the players total hitpoints.

On the other hand, it's kind of like the avoid death cheat option, just watered down a bit.
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Old November 1, 2014, 03:50   #13
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I believe Sangband used to have a mechanic like this for (at least) potions of Death, to encourage test-quaffing of potions. Effectively this would be extending this to all life-threatening situations.

I think on the whole I'm not in favour of this for Angband. The current situation feels more natural to me - there are things which can kill you with a single attack, and if you haven't prepared beforehand, there's nothing you can do. In my opinion (and this really is only a personal opinion) that sense of living on the edge is a large part of the appeal of the game.
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Old November 1, 2014, 09:33   #14
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Hello, I'm a long time lurker of the forum and an old Moria/Angband player. This is a brilliant game and the practically the only game that I still regularly play. Thank you for keeping it alive.

I like being on my toes all the time, but off-screen insta-deaths are real joy killers, so I throw in a couple of ideas and maybe there's something of value here.

1. An amulet or ring of salvation. Basically this would activate when you're going to die. At that point it will break and you'll be back to 1 HP.
2. Going below 0 will permanently damage your constitution and you'll need to raise your contitution with stat potions. The effect could be 1 HP below 0 is 1 permanent Con damage.
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Old November 1, 2014, 10:43   #15
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Doesn't vanilla have detection in various forms? Poscheng has the insta-breath-death thing in spades, but you can usually see it coming with various methods.
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Old November 1, 2014, 16:33   #16
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Doesn't vanilla have detection in various forms? Poscheng has the insta-breath-death thing in spades, but you can usually see it coming with various methods.
The goal is to mitigate the "I didn't know this particular monster could do so much damage" problem encountered by players who are learning the game without spoilers. Vanilla does have plenty of detection methods, and learning to use them properly is vital for high-level play, but I consider that to be a separate issue.
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Old November 1, 2014, 23:19   #17
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I think the idea is interesting, but I think I agree with Nick in that these situations are part of the game. If you are unaware of what certain monsters do in a roguelike, particularly towards the end game, then I feel you shouldn't be surprised if you suddenly die. I personally took advantage of Probing a lot in my early games. I didn't want to pull up spoilers every time I met a new mob, but I had the mentality that if I didn't know what something did it would most likely shit on me.

Perhaps making Rods of Probing a little more common would help, and encourage people to actually use them. In my personal experience I feel like they show up very infrequently, and usually rather late in the game. Perhaps if they were to show up earlier, and be a touch more common they may see more use. It still presents an element of risk, since you still need to spend a turn probing. However, used properly a new player can make much more informed decisions about new monsters and uniques they encounter without having to resort to spoilers.
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Old November 1, 2014, 23:43   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Derakon View Post
The goal is to mitigate the "I didn't know this particular monster could do so much damage" problem encountered by players who are learning the game without spoilers.
I think the issue here is that it's currently kind of a binary choice - use spoilers (or perfect monster memory, or whatever), or expect the unexpected instadeath. Your suggestion kind of provides a middle ground - but in some ways it goes further.

If the new player has access to perfect information, they still have to take the steps to use that information, whereas under your scheme there would be some freedom to just blaze away and worry about dying once you have the "Dying" status.

It's an interesting idea, and I'm glad it's being explored. It's also kind of amusing to think how the discussion would go if this were the way it had always been, and there was a proposal to remove "Dying" status and just let characters die outright
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Old November 2, 2014, 14:29   #19
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In the long run, the thing that needs to be done is make @ and player vision overlap. It does that for the horizontal dimension if you have the center always option set, but vertically the window is too small (or range too long).

I assume changing window format is not an easy task, otherwise it would have been done long ago. Nevertheless, this is the core problem that makes people look for workarounds all the time.

Typically things with massive breath damage are very guessable (D), maybe one can find a way to have monsters like drolems announce their threat better, but once learned, the player knows the danger. Dealing with offscreen monsters remains awkward and unfair.
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Old November 2, 2014, 15:21   #20
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Typically things with massive breath damage are very guessable (D), maybe one can find a way to have monsters like drolems announce their threat better, but once learned, the player knows the danger. Dealing with offscreen monsters remains awkward and unfair.
The simple solution to this is to make the default window size much taller -- at least twice as tall. Modern displays have more than enough room to accommodate a taller window, and the game becomes significantly smoother when you aren't constantly scrolling your view around. I can't remember the last time I had to deal with a monster that was off the edge of the screen.
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