Angband.oook.cz
Angband.oook.cz
AboutVariantsLadderForumCompetitionComicScreenshotsFunniesLinks

Go Back   Angband Forums > Angband > Variants

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old September 12, 2016, 15:20   #1
chris
PosChengband Maintainer
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 702
chris is on a distinguished road
[Announce] Poschengband 5.0.1 Released

Another release of PosChengband (5.0.1) is available in the usual spot. This is just a playtesting release with a few major gameplay changes, but no new classes have been added (I've committed myself to playtesting all the Chengband classes until I am satisfied before adding new stuff. At the moment, I'm working on Warlocks and have tested the Spider (fun!) and Hound pacts, and like them both.) I should also mention that I haven't accessed the internet since the last release, which was a bombshell change to object lore. So I haven't had a chance to see or address all the problems. I'll respond to those for 5.0.2

Now, what changed this release?

Gameplay Changes:
[1] Confusing Lights has been toned down. Seriously, that was crazy before
[2] OK, it was a bit too easy to win with devices, so I made Rockets come slightly later and have higher casting costs. Tiamat got a new reward to celebrate this change.
[3] Grow Mold no longer spams Death molds.
[4] Big change to Archery multipliers and ranges. I never liked the Chengband changes, and some inspection showed that Short Bows and Light Crossbows were too powerful, since they retained the faster shooting rate. In fact, Short Bows are the most damage effective, being even more effective than Heavy Crossbows, which is a bit silly. Ranges have been restored and multipliers reduced, but not all the way to Hengband levels (e.g. Short Bows are now 2.50x). If you are upgrading, your Short Bow and Light Crossbow multipliers will be reduced.
[5] The Birth Autoroller is now a bit more generous. You *can* do two 17s if you are greedy. Or 3 16s. Or 16, 16, 15, 15 even ...
[6] Added option to display range to target. This is mostly for Warlocks, who have extremely gimped targetting ranges, and often need to know when monsters are in range. The option is called display_distance and the range will show up in the monster list for visible monsters, as well as when using the target and look commands.
[7] Jewelry drops from dungeon guardians, quest rewards and DROP_GREAT are no longer insulting in the early game. For example, one of my players got a Barbarian Talisman with -2 Int and nothing else! No more!!
[8] no_wilderness: Playing with this option means you forgo stat gains from dungeon guardians. To compensate, you will gain a chosen stat for each random quest completed (i.e. DL6, DL12, DL24 etc quests in Angband)

Class Playtesting Changes:
[1] Samurai and Mystics no longer automatically concentrate to charge their power. It's annoying to do this by hand, but you don't always want or need the supercharge.
[2] Rune-Knights get reduced benefits from Clarity and Great Clarity.
[3] Tweaked Book of Shadows for Burglary rogues.
[4] Mystics can browse powers to display effective damage
[5] Leprechauns no longer have mana, but instead use gold for their powers. Also, they no longer need quite so much gold to receive various bonuses. They also have a new power called Hoarding.
[6] Giants were a bit silly in the start, being quite weak. I changed their stat allocation so they start stronger, but gain strength less quickly. They are also more stupid, less wise, and quite clumsy.
[7] I playtested a Balrog and found the casting costs a bit too high.
[8] Warrior's Sword Dancing is *much* easier. But still fairly useless ... sigh.
[9] Fixed Magic Eater's regeneration rate for ego regen devices. It was quite a bit too fast before. I finally playtested to completion and found this build strong, but acceptable ... and fun
[10] Magic Eaters: Object display now shows the regen rate.
[11] Magic Eaters: Auto detect traps and Auto ID now work.
[12] Scouts were tweaked, with a few new abilities. It took surprisingly little to make this class fun for me to play, though I haven't played all the way thru yet. Try sniping with the Arrow of Bard some time!
[13] Warlocks: I'm in the middle of playtesting. Angels lose Invulnerability and get Crusade instead (untested). Various warlock pacts offer thematic ways to gain Economical Mana (e.g. Undead Warlock can use the Stone of Death). New abilities added ... But I'm still working on Warlocks, so more to follow.
[14] Evil Priests: Since good priests have an affinity for Life magic, evil priests get a bonus to Death magic. Also, why all the qualms about edged weapons if your evil god delights in bloodshed? Icky weapons, and Bless Weapon are only for good priests (Basically, one never played evil priests before, since Healing is so powerful. Now, perhaps, there will be some more reason to choose the dark side?)
[15] Draconian Metamorphosis: As a Monk, your postures will now effect your innate dragon attack deadliness. I would have playtested this change more, but got squished by Hastur shortly after CL35!

Bug Fixes:
[1] Fixed Barbarian Talisman in the Tengu and Death Swords quest.
[2] Brand Fire/Poison spells weren't giving appropriate resistances.
[3] Fixed Object Lore problem with Ego activations.
[4] Fixed SegFault when viewing Cheat Options.
[5] Doppelganger Samurai/Mystics now decay supercharged mana correctly.
[6] Fixed themed jewelry drops (e.g. Archers should drop rings of archery).
[7] Fixed AI Bug with Shoot posture. Monsters with this AI can now melee if the player is adjacent.
[8] Crossbowmaster's Overdraw was adding +0.01x to the multiplier, rather than +1.00x. (Trifling, I know ...)
[9] Vulnerability to fear no longer removes the player's chances of saving. It was fun to die thanks to my Cloak of Cowardice, and probably deserved as well, but players deserve some chance!

Reported Issues:
[1] Fixed gold exploits with the Rune-Knight
[2] Doppelgangers need to repaint the effect list after stopping mimicry

Minor Tweaks:
[1] Glove encumbrance is displayed in the status list.
[2] Fix message spam for characters that auto Clear Mind. Turn off disturb_minor to remove these messages. (I use disturb_minor quite a bit for message suppression).
[3] Monster Recall now includes the max depth when necessary.
[4] Staves of Identify now come in larger sizes. I've seen them up to 70 charges! You should no longer need to carry 2 in the end game.

Aside: If you are viewing changes to the git repository, you might want to use the --ignore-all-space option. My editor (QtCreator) has an option to clean up whitespace for the entire file as you make changes. Mostly this is the removal of trailing spaces, but it also makes sure the file ends on a blank line to avoid compiler warnings on certain platforms.
chris is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 13, 2016, 05:12   #2
HugoTheGreat2011
Knight
 
HugoTheGreat2011's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Mid-Atlantic, U.S.
Age: 35
Posts: 967
HugoTheGreat2011 is on a distinguished road
Great work! The one change making the difference for me in a good way is the change to autoroller.
__________________
Hugo = usually plays Halo, PosChengband and its Forks, and Sil

My YouTube channel, where I'm known as YggdrasilTid (includes my PosChengband gameplay+music):
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCqG...vf4c0P8ipsIeQQ

My most recent good try at PosChengband 7.0.0's nightmare-mode on Angband.live:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rwAR0WOphUA
HugoTheGreat2011 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 13, 2016, 11:14   #3
Squeak
Rookie
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 17
Squeak is on a distinguished road
Thanks for the changes!

I had a few suggestions for some neglected classes:
1. Blue mages - currently their spells do not benefit from damage bonuses from rings of wizardry. It would make sense IMHO if they do.
2. Archaeologists - with the auto-ID option there is hardly any advantage to playing one, and even without it they are quite underpowered. While they have some powers related to whip use I rarely use whips as I usually find a better weapon. Perhaps archaeologists should have an additional equipment slot that would be dedicated only to whips? That way you could always have a whip on you in addition to your primary weapon. Another useless skill is Polish Shield as by the time you get it you have usually already found a shield of reflection. Polish shield would be useful though if it could be used on artifact or ego shields to add the reflection flag. Perhaps only temporarily?
Squeak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 13, 2016, 13:11   #4
getter77
Adept
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: GA, USA
Age: 33
Posts: 230
getter77 is on a distinguished road
Send a message via AIM to getter77 Send a message via MSN to getter77 Send a message via Yahoo to getter77
Congrats on another big release and that's a really excellent plan on the class playtesting to better shore up the future, immediate and otherwise!
getter77 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 26, 2016, 15:47   #5
chris
PosChengband Maintainer
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 702
chris is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by Squeak View Post
2. Archaeologists - with the auto-ID option there is hardly any advantage to playing one, and even without it they are quite underpowered. While they have some powers related to whip use I rarely use whips as I usually find a better weapon. Perhaps archaeologists should have an additional equipment slot that would be dedicated only to whips? That way you could always have a whip on you in addition to your primary weapon. Another useless skill is Polish Shield as by the time you get it you have usually already found a shield of reflection. Polish shield would be useful though if it could be used on artifact or ego shields to add the reflection flag. Perhaps only temporarily?
Archaeologists are a weak class by design ... I think it is OK to have some variation in the power of various builds (They are stronger than a tourist, however, and there are some fairly powerful digger weapons in the game).

I'll think about Polish Shield for next version, but the traditional use of it is on a decent Dragon Shield. Reflection is very nice in the end game.
chris is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 26, 2016, 20:54   #6
HugoTheGreat2011
Knight
 
HugoTheGreat2011's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Mid-Atlantic, U.S.
Age: 35
Posts: 967
HugoTheGreat2011 is on a distinguished road
Great to hear about the 5.0.2 release

I found a minor bug in 5.0.2:
The Level notation in the object scoring (via 'I' command) doesn't show on all items on characters made before 5.0.2. I think this is expected since that Objection scoring's Level notation is new as part of 5.0.2.
__________________
Hugo = usually plays Halo, PosChengband and its Forks, and Sil

My YouTube channel, where I'm known as YggdrasilTid (includes my PosChengband gameplay+music):
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCqG...vf4c0P8ipsIeQQ

My most recent good try at PosChengband 7.0.0's nightmare-mode on Angband.live:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rwAR0WOphUA
HugoTheGreat2011 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 13, 2016, 16:26   #7
krazyhades
Swordsman
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 427
krazyhades is on a distinguished road
Cool, I'm looking forward to trying out the new version! Thanks Chris! I have a minor bug report at the bottom of my post, after my musings/comments on this new version.

Quote:
Originally Posted by chris View Post
[1] Confusing Lights has been toned down. Seriously, that was crazy before
Yes it was pretty insane. I hope it still has some real use in the late game. Heck, Chaos Warriors don't get their class power of it until 40, which feels (or at least, felt) terrible when they already had multiple copies of the staff by then. I'm interested to see how balancing the power level ranges for spawned devices continues.

Quote:
[2] OK, it was a bit too easy to win with devices, so I made Rockets come slightly later and have higher casting costs. Tiamat got a new reward to celebrate this change.
As far as I could tell, devices were primarily the fallback option for combos with decent device skill for which melee was too risky. It was already a real pain in the ass grinding out enough -Rockets for the J. On the better side, I hope that this means that late-midgame isn't trivialized by some wands, which I imagine is the main thing you were going after (and I totally agree with), but I also fear this change will mostly just require even MORE tedium grinding for -Rockets for the big J on combos that can't stand toe to toe with it. We'll all have to see how it plays out, of course, but I think it may contribute to making some combos (like, say, your Scout winner, which IIRC you tried because...I was frustrated with my scout attempts) just take longer to win.

The issue of tedium/grinding versus gameplay is a serious issue in all *bands, and PosChengband especially, where the design is such that many attempts at balance work by making characters take more time to win and therefore introducing more opportunities for a misstep or bad situation (xp penalties instead of accepting easy vs strong races a la Sil; making rockets rarer to nerf devices; needing to find enough ammo on non-Create-Ammo shooter classes; needing to get one of a tiny list of Worthwile Endgame Weapons on various weapon-restricted classes)

Quote:
[3] Grow Mold no longer spams Death molds.
Heh, well that was cute and still is a relevant ability. Probably a good change.
Quote:
[4] Big change to Archery multipliers and ranges.
Wow that's a major change. No other comments until we see how it plays. It is worth noting that players have been strongly advising people who want to play shooter classes to only play Archer, as playing without Create Ammo involves a lot of tedium.

Quote:
[5] The Birth Autoroller is now a bit more generous. You *can* do two 17s if you are greedy. Or 3 16s. Or 16, 16, 15, 15 even ...
Hmm interesting. I look forward to seeing how this plays. The Autoroller rejecting a new player's stats, and generally just being incredibly confusing to new players while also being one of the first things they have to deal with, has been a real problem when I've been introducing new players (and I've introduced probably on the order of 50-100 new players by now) to the game. Almost every one of them ends up asking, confused, for help at the autoroller screen, and I can only imagine a number of first timers close the game there before even getting to spawn. The autoroller changes have been going in a decent direction, though it's still pretty arcane I expect this will lead to fewer players accidentally accepting a random-stats-with-no-thresholds-because-the-roller-decided-screw-your-expectations.

Quote:
[7] Jewelry drops from dungeon guardians, quest rewards and DROP_GREAT are no longer insulting in the early game. For example, one of my players got a Barbarian Talisman with -2 Int and nothing else! No more!!
YES! On four different Sorcerer attempts I got a Ring of Protection [+1] with no other powers out of the early townquests. I'm looking forward to this change!
Quote:
[8] no_wilderness: Playing with this option means you forgo stat gains from dungeon guardians. To compensate, you will gain a chosen stat for each random quest completed (i.e. DL6, DL12, DL24 etc quests in Angband)
Ooh, I expect elliptic (the most prolific of the no_wilderness players) may like this. Should make NewLife prep less painful for no_wilderness, though you can't protect Angband quests for later like you can the normal dungeon guardians of wilderness mode.


As for the various class and balance changes, I look forward to trying them out!


I've also got a minor BUG REPORT that's not so exciting, but worth a mention: Getting a monster stuck in a burglary-realm (or other player-created) trap (pit trap?) in the Telmora Arena is not yet handled, so you can get stuck in there permanently once the monster disappears.

Thank you for the work and love on this game, chris! I'm getting excited to open it up again.

Last edited by krazyhades; September 13, 2016 at 16:44.
krazyhades is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 14, 2016, 22:15   #8
jevansau
Adept
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Age: 59
Posts: 153
jevansau is on a distinguished road
Thanks again for the work on this variant. I've returned to try it out after a few years, and I'm impressed.
I have tried a couple of monster characters, both created under 5.0.0 and one moved to 5.0.1, and I don't seem to be getting the random quests. What should I look for as the cause of this?
jevansau is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 26, 2016, 15:39   #9
chris
PosChengband Maintainer
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 702
chris is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by krazyhades View Post
Hmm interesting. I look forward to seeing how this plays. The Autoroller rejecting a new player's stats, and generally just being incredibly confusing to new players while also being one of the first things they have to deal with, has been a real problem when I've been introducing new players (and I've introduced probably on the order of 50-100 new players by now) to the game. Almost every one of them ends up asking, confused, for help at the autoroller screen, and I can only imagine a number of first timers close the game there before even getting to spawn. The autoroller changes have been going in a decent direction, though it's still pretty arcane I expect this will lead to fewer players accidentally accepting a random-stats-with-no-thresholds-because-the-roller-decided-screw-your-expectations.
Does the '?' not help out here? For 5.0.2 I've added better UI coloring and updated the help docs even more. The goal of 5.0.1 changes was to make it clear to the player when their requested stat limits were reasonable. In 5.0.2, this should be even more clear (Green will work; Orange maybe, but don't count on it; Red is impossible). Prior to 5.0.1, there was no feedback as to what limits were possible, so this really *should* be an improvement!

BTW, for -Rockets, try hanging out at the bottom of R'lyeh. They are pretty common in vaults and such ...

EDIT: There are even tutorial like screenshots in the docs for the auto-roller!
chris is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 26, 2016, 21:53   #10
HugoTheGreat2011
Knight
 
HugoTheGreat2011's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Mid-Atlantic, U.S.
Age: 35
Posts: 967
HugoTheGreat2011 is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by chris View Post
Does the '?' not help out here? For 5.0.2 I've added better UI coloring and updated the help docs even more. The goal of 5.0.1 changes was to make it clear to the player when their requested stat limits were reasonable. In 5.0.2, this should be even more clear (Green will work; Orange maybe, but don't count on it; Red is impossible). Prior to 5.0.1, there was no feedback as to what limits were possible, so this really *should* be an improvement!

BTW, for -Rockets, try hanging out at the bottom of R'lyeh. They are pretty common in vaults and such ...

EDIT: There are even tutorial like screenshots in the docs for the auto-roller!
In my opinion, change the coloring of the...('S' Restart, 'Q' Quit, '?' Help)... to YELLOW or some color so that new players will be then pay attention to it when they need help
__________________
Hugo = usually plays Halo, PosChengband and its Forks, and Sil

My YouTube channel, where I'm known as YggdrasilTid (includes my PosChengband gameplay+music):
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCqG...vf4c0P8ipsIeQQ

My most recent good try at PosChengband 7.0.0's nightmare-mode on Angband.live:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rwAR0WOphUA
HugoTheGreat2011 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
[Announce] Poschengband 3.4.0 Released chris Variants 224 August 14, 2015 14:21
[Announce] Poschengband 3.1.0 Released chris Variants 182 November 22, 2014 22:23
[Announce] Poschengband 3.3.0 Released chris Variants 322 November 21, 2014 22:17
[Announce] Poschengband 3.2.0 Released chris Variants 76 May 19, 2014 21:56
[Announce] Poschengband 3.0.0 Released chris Variants 189 March 25, 2014 11:00


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 03:30.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.