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Old January 14, 2013, 20:27   #1
Bagplant
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Possible monster memory bug

I've encountered another instance of the bug I described in my "rogue winner on mobile device" thread in AAR (where I ended up with monster memory showing Dracolich dropping "up to 37 good objects" after killing one that had picked up half the objects in the dungeon). This time it's with Wormtongue, who spent a while wandering around picking things up before I killed him and dropped them all along with his regular drop. Now on encountering him again with a new character (same monster memory) it shows him as dropping "up to 7 exceptional objects".

Other data points: this was definitely not the first time I had encountered Wormtongue, or killed him for that matter. As I recall the monster memory was normal after those cases, so it seems like it changed after the latest kill. I'm also pretty sure that other dracoliches I killed in the earlier game did not drop 37 objects, so I suspect it's a bug with the memory only and not the drops themselves.
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Old January 14, 2013, 22:00   #2
Derakon
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Yeah, the bug is that the monster memory doesn't differentiate between items that the monster had in inventory when they spawned, and items that the monster picked up. So when you see a monster drop a large number of carried items, those items count towards the "can drop up to X items" displayed in the monster memory.

For example, Wormtongue can drop 1-2 exceptional items, normally. Say he spawns with 1 item in inventory, and picks up 30 more. His monster memory when you kill him will say that he can drop up to 31 exceptional items.

I don't know what a reasonable fix is; it doesn't seem reasonable for the character to be able to distinguish between the items the monster "innately" has vs. those they found lying around.
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Old January 15, 2013, 04:05   #3
Bagplant
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Derakon View Post
Yeah, the bug is that the monster memory doesn't differentiate between items that the monster had in inventory when they spawned, and items that the monster picked up. So when you see a monster drop a large number of carried items, those items count towards the "can drop up to X items" displayed in the monster memory.

For example, Wormtongue can drop 1-2 exceptional items, normally. Say he spawns with 1 item in inventory, and picks up 30 more. His monster memory when you kill him will say that he can drop up to 31 exceptional items.

I don't know what a reasonable fix is; it doesn't seem reasonable for the character to be able to distinguish between the items the monster "innately" has vs. those they found lying around.
In this case I knew exactly which item was his innate drop, because it was the only one that wasn't identified. In other cases if I had already seen the item, or saw him pick it up, I'd know it wasn't an innate drop. If he picked up an item that I hadn't seen yet then it would be ambiguous, but most of the time I can tell which is which.

I think the simplest solution would be to just use the innate drop value from the edit file entry for the monster and move on. While I take your point on what the player might reasonably be able to conclude from observations, in my opinion 'reasonable' does not always equate to 'fun' or 'worth spending developer time on.' Plus it could be a slippery slope (how do you know that any monster has innate drops at all, and didn't just grab some items off camera using an as yet unobserved pick up items ability?)
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