Angband.oook.cz
Angband.oook.cz
AboutVariantsLadderForumCompetitionComicScreenshotsFunniesLinks

Go Back   Angband Forums > Angband > Vanilla

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old March 15, 2018, 01:06   #41
Gwarl
Knight
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 599
Gwarl is on a distinguished road
I think heal on kills is a bit too hengband-y for V, even experimental new V. But it would be interesting to gain a power-up on kills. 1d(monsterlevel) SP for instance could sustain offensive spellcasting - as long as you keep killing. But perhaps randonly selected from other buffs like blessing, heroism, regeneration, short duration speed etc - encouraging our doomed warrior to continue pursuing his fate rather than using ?teleport like he ought.
Gwarl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 15, 2018, 02:43   #42
Nick
Vanilla maintainer
 
Nick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Canberra, Australia
Age: 53
Posts: 7,190
Donated: $60
Nick is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gwarl View Post
I think heal on kills is a bit too hengband-y for V, even experimental new V. But it would be interesting to gain a power-up on kills. 1d(monsterlevel) SP for instance could sustain offensive spellcasting - as long as you keep killing. But perhaps randonly selected from other buffs like blessing, heroism, regeneration, short duration speed etc - encouraging our doomed warrior to continue pursuing his fate rather than using ?teleport like he ought.
You appear to have been reading my mind
__________________
One for the Dark Lord on his dark throne
In the Land of Mordor where the Shadows lie.
Nick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 15, 2018, 13:20   #43
Gwarl
Knight
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 599
Gwarl is on a distinguished road
Oh, if you are open to inspiration from other variants, check out the Darkslayer (and Crusader) class from Multiband if you aren't familiar, it has some interesting mechanics. You don't have to play one but the mechanics are documented in the helpfiles.
Gwarl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 8, 2018, 15:44   #44
wobbly
Veteran
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Adelaide, Australia
Posts: 1,665
wobbly is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by wobbly View Post
Can we decouple the ranger/archer bonus from the bow. It's a nice fit for elfs/humans but a slinger is a nicer feel on a hobbit & I'd prefer a crossbow when playing a gnome/dwarf.
Sorry for self quote but looking through the books, any mention of hobbits & wars is always archers so I guess bows are more authentic.
wobbly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 11, 2018, 03:29   #45
jevansau
Adept
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Age: 59
Posts: 155
jevansau is on a distinguished road
Played through a Dunadan Ranger with randarts. Thoughts:
VERY different to previous versions.

Basically only seriously used a missile weapon (sling briefly then bow) for the early to early mid game, and to take out Sauron. Useful slay/branded ammo is scarce, and missile damage much lower than melee (< half ).
Sauron was an exception because I found a x4, +27 damage, acid branding bow on L99 (along with the one ring). With arrows of wounding this was just better than any melee I had without aggravating. Still went back to melee for Morgoth using the one.

The spells in book 1 are all useful throughout, as are haste and herbal healing.
I'd like to know more about what decoy does, because I never managed to find a good use for it in practice. Cover tracks could be useful, but I think I only benefited from it once. By the time I found the book, I had superb stealth, and it only went up from there.

On the whole, the ranger plays as a slightly inferior rogue without the stealing. They both have different subsets of the useful spells, though the holes are mostly easier to fill for the rogue (haste excepted). Having Wisdom as the spell stat makes the traditional races less suitable, although running out of mana ceases to be a problem quite early.

If you want them to have more of a different feel, need to decide what their strengths should be.
If they are meant to be primarily archers, they need to be able to do more damage that way, or be safer fighting at range, or both. I'd prefer the former because the latter leads to tedium.

Cutting extra shots, glyph, ammo improving/ branding all make archery less attractive.
I can see and approve of the nerfing of extra shots, but I think you either need to give a bit more - maybe +1 per 5 levels, or maybe give a might bonus as well.
Also, damage seems to be balanced assuming the availability of branded ammo. For whatever reason, useful ammo is very rare. I saw no slay evil or holy might ammunition for anything, and one stack of acid branded arrows.
Either base damage needs to be higher, or good slay/branded ammo needs to be much more common, or there needs to be a way to create it. Thematically, giving Rangers poison branding at some level would also be appropriate.

While ranger was my favorite class, so far it is my least under the new stream. Mind you, I have found the other new classes to be improvements over the originals. I haven't tried a blackguard or warrior yet, but have tried the others.

On a side note, the max depths (and maybe min depths, although that is more controversial) for randarts should reflect their relative strength within their type (weapon, armour, shield, cloak, crown/helmet, light, amulet, ring, launcher, gloves). This is primarily a problem for lights.
Also, lights seem heavily biased to torches, with star's and arkenstones being very rare. I don't know how the type is selected now, but maybe even selection with no more than one of any type would be a good minimum. This would be weaker on average than standarts, but not as bad as now.
jevansau is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 11, 2018, 04:52   #46
Derakon
Prophet
 
Derakon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 8,504
Derakon is on a distinguished road
I think branded ammo had to be made rare under the previous system because it made the unbalanced nature of extra shots really blatantly, un-ignorably obvious. With extra shots being nerfed, branded ammo (and branded launchers) could become more common.
Derakon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 11, 2018, 12:59   #47
Nick
Vanilla maintainer
 
Nick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Canberra, Australia
Age: 53
Posts: 7,190
Donated: $60
Nick is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by jevansau View Post
Played through a Dunadan Ranger with randarts.
Thanks for the thorough feedback. I am not surprised that the nerf to extra shots was overdone; I think +1 every 5 levels sounds good. Maybe some reduced rarity of ego ammo would be good, or maybe a temporary bow brand spell (or both).
__________________
One for the Dark Lord on his dark throne
In the Land of Mordor where the Shadows lie.
Nick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 20, 2018, 06:08   #48
jevansau
Adept
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Age: 59
Posts: 155
jevansau is on a distinguished road
Played through a Blackguard with randarts:
To me the blackguard plays like an inferior warrior, EXCEPT for the shield bash which tends to make them stronger than a warrior against susceptible opponents. Given that, the spells seem underwhelming and/or maybe inappropriate. Given the class is so warrior-like, you build a character exclusively for combat. This often leaves you with little mana for the first chunk of the game.
The bless/berserk are appropriate but inconsequential by the time you get them given how good the base combat is. Fear could be useful, and poison branding is decent and could be useful.
Piercing shot is useful, but really would be more appropriate for the ranger.
Generally though, you want to be in melee, and by the time you have the book 2 spells there are only a very few opponents where you want to force them out of melee range. ( Throw Monster, Forceful Blow)
Thirst for Blood is interesting, but I never found a situation where it was worth the risk. If it was very shallow, I could see using it to power up on a group of Orcs before tackling the unique that would otherwise be too strong, but by the time you get it, you don't need it.

Overall, I'd say it shows promise, but the spells need a rethink.
jevansau is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 20, 2018, 07:10   #49
Thraalbee
Swordsman
 
Thraalbee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Stockholm
Posts: 450
Thraalbee is on a distinguished road
I find Blackguard an ideal ironman warrior. Outside ironman agreed less interesting.
Thraalbee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 20, 2018, 23:59   #50
Derakon
Prophet
 
Derakon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 8,504
Derakon is on a distinguished road
Might it make sense for the Blackguard to cast spells from HP instead of SP?
Derakon is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Class/magic feature branch Nick Vanilla 759 August 13, 2018 07:50
Attention casters: dungeon books are now artifacts Magnate v4 60 April 14, 2012 15:56
Success of pure casters? Chud Vanilla 14 April 9, 2011 17:27
Ranger magic... miyazaki Vanilla 43 April 30, 2010 01:35
Casters and gloves? EvilScoop Vanilla 6 March 1, 2008 07:33


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 19:29.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.