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Old November 10, 2017, 04:09   #11
Pete Mack
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What's the point of flanking without sprinting?
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Old November 10, 2017, 11:36   #12
Gothmog
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After making this post I am doing much better by doing more or less the same thing I've done before making it.

I am getting much cheekier now which is good and bad, yesterday I had a run where I found a -2 to melee axe and a -1 to melee greatsword very quickly which got me to about 400ft, then I found Calris (yes I decreased rarity but not making it gurenteed to find it) and I promptly died about 20-30 turns later to a Warg, some Easterlings and a Hummerhorn (who was the main cause of my death because he confused me the bastard) because I felt unstoppable with Calris.

I am going to try your tactic next time, I was thinking of getting keen senses (or crowd fighting) because it's annoying when I blunder into a room and an enemy (in the room) covers the door I came from and more enemies surround me (this is how I died in the run above, it was a circular vault with a chasm in the middle and the Warg immediately sprinted to the door while the Hummerhorn flew over the chasm, confused me, and the Easterlings came along the sides. Also funny you mentioned bailing, because in the run I just mentioned I was having a lot of fun just messing around and ducking and diving enemies by using stairs much more often than usual.

Last edited by Gothmog; November 10, 2017 at 13:31.
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Old November 11, 2017, 01:49   #13
ripforareason
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete Mack View Post
What's the point of flanking without sprinting?
You can fight in open rooms instead of corridors, while still only fighting 1 enemy at a time, while also getting +3 to evasion every turn, while also being able to get pseudo-haste when quaffing !quickness. Since you can fight in open areas, you avoid getting owned when a pack ambushes you from behind while fighting something else, like you might if you were always fighting in corridors. I never get sprinting for what it's worth, except on an archer. I think you can actually chain flanking with sprinting, but it's kind of difficult to use in practice unless the room and enemies' positions are just right.

Edit: Also crowd fighting isn't good imo, I wouldn't bother with it unless you're doing a very low evasion character for some reason and going all-in on protection. Flanking is just better. Also, don't be afraid to use a rage herb or something if you get a big pack that you can't escape from. if you stack rage, quickness and maybe a dexterity potion with zoc and flanking you can really tear through a lot of enemies.
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Old November 11, 2017, 11:36   #14
Patashu
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Flanking + Sprinting synergizes very well, you just need to run in a circle like this around enemies:

Code:
.@@.
@..@
@..@
.@@.
And if you can't run in that exact pattern you can elongate it, turn it in the other direction, etc. And now you have quickness all the time without needing to drink the potion
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Old November 12, 2017, 03:43   #15
ripforareason
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patashu View Post
Flanking + Sprinting synergizes very well, you just need to run in a circle like this around enemies:

Code:
.@@.
@..@
@..@
.@@.
And if you can't run in that exact pattern you can elongate it, turn it in the other direction, etc. And now you have quickness all the time without needing to drink the potion
Right, I've just found that it can be tricky to actually get this off when there's a few enemies walking around, some of them might be fast, etc.
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Old November 12, 2017, 05:26   #16
wobbly
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Yeah packs of fast erratic movers like wolves or cats have a habit of getting in the way of your patterns & if you're ZOCing being fast is a mixed blessing. Often it can be easier to hold pattern at the same speed.

I like sprinting more with charge+flanking. I tend to use strafing runs more then circles. It's simpler & also easier to adjust to changing circumstances. When you do a line through the centre of a room you have a lot more room to maneuver if you need to break away. Circles tend to move you closer to the corner of the room, it's easier to end up cornered & harder to change directions.

Re Crowd Fighting, I usually take this at some point though quite often that's just before the throne room. It's got a similar thing to parry going on where you do the maths & work out which is cheaper, the raw evasion or the ability.
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Old November 12, 2017, 16:51   #17
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It might be a good learning experience to pick a Doriath, plenty of song, a little stealth, a disguise and nothing else. Upgrade to Song of Lorien on second floor. Now move about increase stealth and perception. Watching all the different types of opponents when they are not aware of your presence can help in picking up a few good habits when you play something more martial again.
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