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View Poll Results: How do you build V?
I don't - I play a pre-built version 11 39.29%
I use the defaults - I run ./configure with no options 5 17.86%
I use --with-setgid=games for system-wide scores, but I don't change the default paths 3 10.71%
I use --with-no-install or --prefix because I want it all in one place 8 28.57%
I use specific paths (--with-configpath/libpath/varpath, --data[root]dir etc.) 1 3.57%
Voters: 28. You may not vote on this poll

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Old September 20, 2011, 18:54   #21
Azerath
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About Windows and UAC (those popups for permissions) - Administrator account is "disabled" by default (at leat in Win7, don't remember Vista). Post installation user is part of "admiinstrators", but running with reduced permissions for typical daily work. Can be completly disabled easily.

Honestly for me for last half year 99.9% of popup on Win7 triggered was by launching "setup" like "app".

Similiar to me running *NIX - after years working on Win, so called user experience scares me :-( Ech... probably we could argue days for/against our OSes :-)

But I'm not going to advocate to any of you for switching to Windows - your choice. Just keep in mind that there are other (non *NIX) OSes OR O$es ;-) and we don't have to express each time how all of us not like others :-)
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Old September 20, 2011, 18:57   #22
Magnate
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Sorry, I got a bit vehement there (I find myself running "setup like app"s all the time so it's very frustrating). I didn't mean that Windows users are idiots, I meant that Microsoft wants to treat them like that.

I'm aware that Windows has a lot of advantages of familiarity and ease of use, and I still use XP for almost all gaming.
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Old September 20, 2011, 19:23   #23
Timo Pietilš
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnate View Post
Unix distinguishes between "users" and "administrators". Only admins can upgrade software, so the problem does not arise. ISTR that Windows makes this distinction too - but the default permissions for a new user are admin permissions!
Anybody can run and upgrade and delete and so on programs they just plain run from directories they have full access, Angband place in that case would be in \Documents\angbandthisandthat -directory.

Angband doesn't require installation.

You could do an multi-user installation package from it, but for doing it properly does require that you create an .msi out of angband where angband compile puts /save/ and /bones/ in the user profile under local settings (non-roaming part in WinVista & 7, directory name is different). I don't know how to build such version of angband exe. I know how to make that an .msi.
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Old September 20, 2011, 19:27   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Timo Pietilš View Post
Anybody can run and upgrade and delete and so on programs they just plain run from directories they have full access, Angband place in that case would be in \Documents\angbandthisandthat -directory.

Angband doesn't require installation.

You could do an multi-user installation package from it, but for doing it properly does require that you create an .msi out of angband where angband compile puts /save/ and /bones/ in the user profile under local settings (non-roaming part in WinVista & 7, directory name is different). I don't know how to build such version of angband exe. I know how to make that an .msi.
Oh wow, that's excellent. It should be easy enough to modify Makefile.win to build angband using local settings as you describe, so you could then build an msi for system-wide Windows installs. Not that there seems to be much of a market for those, but it's a nice idea.
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"3.4 is much better than 3.1, 3.2 or 3.3. It still is easier than 3.0.9, but it is more convenient to play without being ridiculously easy, so it is my new favorite of the versions." - Timo Pietila
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Old September 20, 2011, 21:20   #25
Azerath
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Still I would stick to read blog post from my previous and deicide what would fit the best.

About this "Documents" are you referring to Documents "library" feature that is sandboxed for each user? If so maybe we could reuse "Documents\My Games" folder that is for... save games and or per user game data ;-)

Additionally I would suggest to not hardcode folder/location name - it can be translated in non-en languages and or changed/relocated, etc. Just dig around MSDN and fide required function or method to universally retrieve interesting paths/names.

Just briefly read Windows Logo Something and you will see that there are a lot of things to make to be good Windows citizen.

I would stick to what is right now - Angband is small - takes probably less than fraction of percent of HDD, so "install by unzip" is OK, uless you target for broader set of users, then regular install package (use open source, MS WiX project to create installers) with proper updates, etc will be better option (and use special windows folder for those purposes)

Really, define scenario, vision goal, and the hammer can be found.
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Old September 20, 2011, 21:57   #26
Timo Pietilš
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Azerath View Post
Additionally I would suggest to not hardcode folder/location name - it can be translated in non-en languages and or changed/relocated, etc. Just dig around MSDN and fide required function or method to universally retrieve interesting paths/names.
What you see in Win7/Vista UI as folder name is not the actual folder name if it is localized. Underlying core structure of the filesystem is same for all languages, you can see the real directory names from command line with some dir-command switch which I don't remember just now. 64 bit Win7 in particular is very good at telling people that it does something that it didn't really do, but did something else to keep you thinking that it did same thing as in older windowses. It gets really messy thing very fast to understand what it really going on inside it when you install old 32bit windows program in 64bit Win 7. What kind of magic tricks it does to run it just like it did in old 32bit XP.

Anyway windows installer does all kinds of magic with "special" folders automatically, I would only need to define that it goes to user profile under some directory and it does it correctly automatically without any unnecessary tweaking. Building a version of angband.exe that does refer to that directory dynamically would be a bit harder thing to do (I imagine). It would probably need to use some environment variable or WMI query for folder location. If we start to add WMI queries in angband code it changes things a lot more complicated than they are now.

I prefer we keep angband simple single-user system for now.
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