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Old October 17, 2016, 12:21   #1
mibert
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Join Date: Mar 2016
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Advice for char

Hi all,

I got a nice char going and I was hardly that deep ever, so I'd love some general advice what to do in terms of strategy, skills, etc..

Thanks!

Also I was wondering if there is some consensus on what the easiest noob char would be. I'd like to just book a win

Code:
  [Sil 1.3.0-mpa Character Dump]

 Name   Brut          Age    3,826       Str   4 =  3  +1
 Race   Noldor        Height             Dex   5 =  4          +1
 House  Feanor        Weight             Con   5 =  4  +1
                                         Gra   3

 Game Turn   10,751   Melee  (+21,2d9)   Melee       21 = 16  +5  -1  +1
 Exp Pool     1,291   Bows   (+13,2d9)   Archery     13 = 10  +5  -3  +1
 Total Exp   33,291   Armor [+18,7-20]   Evasion     18 = 10  +5  +3
 Burden       160.9                      Stealth      1 =  0  +5  -4
 Max Burden   207.3   Health     49:49   Perception  12 =  7  +3  +2
 Depth         600'   Voice      34:34   Will         7 =  2  +3  +2
 Min Depth     450'                      Smithing     6 =  2  +3      +1
 Light Radius     3                      Song         3 =  0  +3

 You are one of several children of a prince from the house of Feanor.
 You have light grey eyes, straight black hair, and a fair complexion.






  [Equipment]

a) The Longsword 'Orcrist' (+2,2d5) [+2] <+2> 3.0 lb
   It improves your perception by 2.  It slays orcs and trolls.  
   It cannot be harmed by the elements.  
b) a Longbow (+0,2d6) 3.0 lb
   It can shoot arrows 20 squares (with your current strength).
c) a Jade Ring of Accuracy (+1)
d) a Marble Ring of Frost
   It provides resistance to fire.  
e) a Ruby Amulet of Constitution <+0>
   It increases your constitution by 0.  It sustains your 
   constitution.  
f) a Feanorian Lamp of True Sight
   It provides resistance to blindness and hallucination.  It
   grants you the ability to see invisible creatures.  
g) a Mail Corslet of Resilience (-1) [-3,2d4] <+1>
   It increases your constitution by 1.  It cannot be harmed by
   the elements.  
h) a Cloak of Protection [+1,1d1]
   It cannot be harmed by the elements.  
i) a Kite Shield of Deflection (-2) [+2,1d6]
   It cannot be harmed by the elements.  
j) a Helm of Defiance [-1,1d3] <+2>
   It improves your will by 2.  It provides resistance to fear.  
   
k) a Set of Gauntlets of Strength (-1) [+0,1d1] <+1>
   It increases your strength by 1.  
l) a Pair of Boots [+0,1d1]
m) 93 Arrows
   They can be shot 20 squares (with your current strength and bow).
n) 50 Arrows (Poisoned)
   They are branded with venom.  They can be shot 20 squares
   (with your current strength and bow).


  [Inventory]

a) 3 Pale Green Herbs of Rage
b) a Thorny Herb of Sustenance
c) 3 Mottled Herbs of Healing
d) a Dark Green Herb of Restoration
e) 7 Fragments of Lembas
f) 11 Murky Brown Potions of Orcish Liquor
g) a Green Potion of Clarity
h) 3 Dark Green Potions of Healing
i) 6 Bright Orange Potions of Slow Poison
j) 6 Sparkling Potions of Quickness
k) 3 Shimmering Potions of Strength
l) an Emerald Potion of Grace
m) an Ivory Staff of Light (4 charges)
n) a Gnarled Staff of Slumber (5 charges)
o) a Beech Staff of Majesty (6 charges)
p) a Willow Staff of Warding (3 charges)
q) an Aspen Staff of Recharging (2 charges)
r) a Mail Corslet of Protection (-1) [-3,2d5]
   It cannot be harmed by the elements.  
s) a Battle Axe of Gondolin (-3,3d5) 5.0 lb
   It slays orcs and trolls.  It does extra damage when wielded
   with both hands.  
t) a Mattock of Belegost (-5,5d2) <+3> 13.0 lb
   It improves your tunneling by 3.  It requires both hands to
   wield it properly.  
u) 31 Arrows (+3)
   They can be shot 20 squares (with your current strength and bow).
v) 12 Arrows
   They can be shot 20 squares (with your current strength and bow).


  [Abilities]

Power
Finesse
Flaming Arrows
Dexterity
Parry
Lore-Keeper
Lore-Master
Weaponsmith


  [Enemies]

 10 / 15  Wolf                                    
  5 / 22  Tanglethorn                             
 12 / 19  Orc                                     
  3 /  3  Grimhawk                                
  4 /  5  Orc scout                               
 14 / 14  Spider hatchling                        
  3 /  3  Blue serpent                            
 20 / 41  Orc soldier                             
  4 /  8  Madthorn                                
  0 /  1  Gorcrow                                 
 26 / 31  Orc archer                              
 22 / 26  White wolf                              
  5 /  5  Red serpent                             
 17 / 31  Orc warrior                             
  2 /  3  Sword spider                            
 15 / 15  Crebain                                 
  4 /  4  Mewlip                                  
  0 /  2  Orc thief                               
  2 /  2  Nightthorn                              
  2 /  2  Green serpent                           
  8 /  8  Mountain troll                          
  1 /  2  Tattered wight                          
  (slain) Boldog, the Merciless 
 10 / 12  Orc champion                            
 15 / 24  Easterling warrior                      
 20 / 21  Hummerhorn                              
  2 /  3  Orc captain                             
 31 / 40  Warg                                    
  5 /  5  Grave wight                             
  1 /  1  Dark serpent                            
  (slain) Orcobal, Champion of the Orcs 
 20 / 21  Whispering shadow                       
 14 / 15  Distended spider                        
 15 / 17  Easterling archer                       
  1 /  1  Twisted bat                             
 15 / 16  Snow troll                              
 11 / 16  Giant                                   
  (slain) Uldor, the Accursed 
  7 /  9  Easterling spy                          
  0 /  2  Shadow bat                              
  6 /  7  Sulrauko                                
  3 /  3  Fire-drake hatchling                    
  (slain) Ulfang the Black 
  (slain) Duruin, Least of the Balrogs 
  7 /  7  Werewolf                                
  1 /  1  Shadow spider                           
  1 /  1  Shadow                                  
  1 /  2  Sapphire serpent                        
  (slain) Gilim, the Giant of Eruman 
  1 /  1  Ruby serpent                            
  2 /  2  Ringrauko                               
  3 /  3  Cat warrior                             


  [Notes]

Brut of the Noldor
Entered Angband on 16 Oct 2016

   Turn     Depth   Note

      0     50 ft   (Power)
      0     50 ft   (Weaponsmith)
    909    100 ft   Made a Longbow (+0,2d5)  3.0 lb
    969    100 ft   Made a Mattock (-5,5d2) <+2>  11.0 lb
    979    100 ft   Made 24 Arrows  2.4 lb
  2,404    200 ft   Made 24 Arrows  2.4 lb
  2,414    200 ft   Made 24 Arrows  2.4 lb
  2,424    200 ft   Made 24 Arrows  2.4 lb
  2,907    250 ft   Found The Longsword 'Orcrist'
  3,108    250 ft   (Parry)
  4,146    350 ft   Found The Dagger of Nargil
  5,343    350 ft   Found The Shortbow of Celegorm
  5,744    400 ft   Encountered Boldog, the Merciless
  5,754    400 ft   Slew Boldog, the Merciless
  5,754    400 ft   Found The Spear of Boldog
  6,021    400 ft   (Flaming Arrows)
  6,813    450 ft   (Lore-Keeper)
  6,874    450 ft   (Lore-Master)
  7,568    500 ft   Encountered Uldor, the Accursed
  7,617    500 ft   Slew Uldor, the Accursed
  8,977    550 ft   Encountered Ulfang the Black
  9,035    550 ft   Slew Ulfang the Black
  9,788    550 ft   Encountered Orcobal, Champion of the Orcs
  9,800    550 ft   Slew Orcobal, Champion of the Orcs
  9,863    550 ft   Encountered Duruin, Least of the Balrogs
  9,912    550 ft   Destroyed Duruin, Least of the Balrogs
 10,088    600 ft   Found The Amulet of Tinfang Gelion
 10,563    600 ft   Encountered Gilim, the Giant of Eruman
 10,600    600 ft   Slew Gilim, the Giant of Eruman
 10,732    600 ft   (Dexterity)
 10,732    600 ft   (Finesse)



  ['Score' 012089249]
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Old October 17, 2016, 16:39   #2
Infinitum
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Probably enough will to get Poison resistance, Rauko-Bane, then Riposte & everything into evasion. Actually, you probably want some more evasion before building to anything else; 10 is kinda low for the depth. Aim for 20/20+ evasion/melee for the throneroom, add some song and song of slaying for convenience. Having both Power/Finesse is generally considered a bit of a waste (it's effectively a very expensive STR point). Don't mind it for now though.

You can safely drop the axe and protection corslet; use Mattock for statues and Orcrist for everything else. Try finding a source of free action before dancing with dragons (or spiders). Good luck.
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Old October 17, 2016, 19:46   #3
mibert
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Infinitum View Post
Probably enough will to get Poison resistance, Rauko-Bane, then Riposte & everything into evasion. Actually, you probably want some more evasion before building to anything else; 10 is kinda low for the depth. Aim for 20/20+ evasion/melee for the throneroom, add some song and song of slaying for convenience. Having both Power/Finesse is generally considered a bit of a waste (it's effectively a very expensive STR point). Don't mind it for now though.

You can safely drop the axe and protection corslet; use Mattock for statues and Orcrist for everything else. Try finding a source of free action before dancing with dragons (or spiders). Good luck.
Thank you very much. Really good info.I picked Finesse to make using Orcrist more attractive.

Anyways, just died around 750. I thought I could take on belegwath. a few cats joined and it went south fast. I dont think I could have killed him anyways though.
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Old October 17, 2016, 20:05   #4
wobbly
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I think taking finesse late on a power build is fine. Realistically if power-> follow through -> momentum & 20 melee is fine then power -> follow through -> momentum, & 19 melee+finesse should be even better once you've got a slaying bonus cranked up.
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Old October 18, 2016, 12:43   #5
wobbly
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mibert View Post
Hi all,
Also I was wondering if there is some consensus on what the easiest noob char would be. I'd like to just book a win
Perhaps be a touch more specific? I actually find stealth easier then melee but that's a matter of preference, most people like to warrior.

Stealth archery on a finarfin is one of the easier options in my opinion. Start with song of elbereth (good for keeping out of melee or shooting fleeing enemies), take enough smithing for arrows, pick up loremaster & listen at some stage.
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Old October 18, 2016, 18:27   #6
mibert
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wobbly View Post
Perhaps be a touch more specific? I actually find stealth easier then melee but that's a matter of preference, most people like to warrior.

Stealth archery on a finarfin is one of the easier options in my opinion. Start with song of elbereth (good for keeping out of melee or shooting fleeing enemies), take enough smithing for arrows, pick up loremaster & listen at some stage.
Thanks!
Sounds good. I killed many stealthy archers
Do you use versatility or put some into melee initially?
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Old October 18, 2016, 18:36   #7
wobbly
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Either, or. Versatility is good if you still want to use rage in the throne room, I usually just sleep him with a staff instead. 5 & charge is not bad if you just want a bit of melee. If you've started with Elbereth you don't need any pts in melee to reach the 1st forge & grab a long bow. A high elf can kill a wolf without & you can always spend the pts on evasion instead.
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Old October 19, 2016, 07:25   #8
mibert
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wobbly View Post
Either, or. Versatility is good if you still want to use rage in the throne room, I usually just sleep him with a staff instead. 5 & charge is not bad if you just want a bit of melee. If you've started with Elbereth you don't need any pts in melee to reach the 1st forge & grab a long bow. A high elf can kill a wolf without & you can always spend the pts on evasion instead.
Ok, cool. Do you have a char dump to check out perhaps, I wanna give your build a try.

my stealthy archers looked like this mostly: dogding, sprinting, disguise, versatility, aiming for exchange places, pump archery, die
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Old October 19, 2016, 20:08   #9
wobbly
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Ok realised I didn't have exactly the kind of build I was talking about so I'm putting one through at the moment. Trouble is I found a good set of mail, so he's not actually stealthy. With fear it's easier in heavy armour at the start (when your stealth is bad) & lighter armour at the end (once your stealth is good). It's not as a noobie friendly as I remember it being, I forgot how many tricks I use. Oh well if you still want to give it a go a big part of getting it to work is luring things you don't want to fight to the stairs then pushing them of the level.
The mattock(+charge) is there for grotesques by the way.

This beor is more sort of straight stealth+archery: http://angband.oook.cz/ladder-show.php?id=19316
you'll see I never took much archery. I just don't fight anything I don't have too.

& on a falathrim: http://angband.oook.cz/ladder-show.php?id=18953
Again, archery isn't that high & I didn't bother getting any till I had sprinting/exchange places.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mibert View Post
my stealthy archers looked like this mostly: dogding, sprinting, disguise, versatility, aiming for exchange places, pump archery, die
I suspect the die part is fighting things you should be running away from. If in doubt run, get of the level if you need to. The whole pt of sprinting/exchange places is to run away from most things. The rest looks about right.

I'm not sure how worth it versatility is. It can be good on the kind of build where your trying to save arrows or if you don't have exchange places/pt blank archery or if you want to build song of slaying with rage herbs. However when you have the tools to just run away why melee on an archer?
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Old October 20, 2016, 09:44   #10
mibert
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Here's one more so far successful try with the melee/evasion char.

any advice is very welcome.

I took momentum as i planned to use the defender longsword with a shield, but then i found Glend and am currently using that.

Code:
  [Sil 1.3.0-mpa Character Dump]

 Name   Brut          Age    3,826       Str   5 =  3  +2
 Race   Noldor        Height             Dex   5 =  4          +1
 House  Feanor        Weight             Con   4
                                         Gra   2 =  3      -1

 Game Turn   12,277   Melee (+19,3d12)   Melee       19 = 17  +5  -4  +1
 Exp Pool     1,521   Bows   (+13,2d7)   Archery     13 = 10  +5  -3  +1
 Total Exp   33,121   Armor [+15,7-19]   Evasion     15 = 10  +5
 Burden       134.4                      Stealth      0 =  0  +5  -5
 Max Burden   248.7   Health     41:41   Perception   2 =  0  +2
 Depth         650'   Voice      28:28   Will         2 =  0  +2
 Min Depth     500'                      Smithing     5 =  2  +2      +1
 Light Radius     2                      Song         2 =  0  +2

 You are one of several children of a prince from the house of Feanor.
 You have light grey eyes, straight black hair, and a fair complexion.






  [Equipment]

a) The Greatsword 'Glend' (-1,3d6) [+1] <+1> 12.0 lb
   It increases your strength by 1.  It sustains your strength.  
   It cannot be harmed by the elements.  It requires both hands
   to wield it properly.  
b) a Longbow of Radiance (+0,2d5) 2.5 lb
   It fires shining arrows.  It can shoot arrows 20 squares
   (with your current strength).
c) a Sapphire Ring of Protection [+0,1d2]
d) a Bronze Ring of Strength <+1>
   It increases your strength by 1.  It sustains your strength.  
   
e) a Coral Amulet of Constitution <+0>
   It increases your constitution by 0.  It sustains your 
   constitution.  
f) a Brass Lantern of True Sight (6416 turns)
   It provides resistance to blindness and hallucination.  It
   grants you the ability to see invisible creatures.  
g) a Hauberk of Venom's End (-2) [-4,2d6]
   It provides resistance to poison.  
h) a Cloak of Protection [+1,1d1]
   It cannot be harmed by the elements.  
i) (nothing)
j) a Dwarf Mask [-2,1d2]
   It provides resistance to fire.  
k) a Set of Gauntlets of Swordplay (-1) [+0,1d1]
   It grants you the ability: Parry.  
l) The Pair of Boots of Finrod [+3,1d1]
   It grants you freedom of movement.  It cannot be harmed by
   the elements.  
m) 60 Arrows
   They can be shot 20 squares (with your current strength and bow).
n) 99 Arrows {special}
   They can be shot 20 squares (with your current strength and bow).


  [Inventory]

a) 5 Wrinkled Herbs of Rage
b) 4 Fragments of Lembas
c) a Black Herb {restoration, tried}
d) a Flask of oil
e) a Clear Potion of Miruvor
f) 4 Murky Brown Potions of Orcish Liquor
g) a Shimmering Potion of Clarity
h) 4 Sparkling Potions of Healing
i) a Dark Blue Potion of Slow Poison
j) 4 Vermilion Potions of Quickness
k) 2 Crimson Potions of Elemental Resistance
l) 2 Brown Potions of Dexterity
m) a Sky Blue Potion of Constitution
n) a Black Potion of Grace
o) an Aspen Staff of Light
p) a Golden Staff of Sanctity (used 3 times)
q) a Moonstone Ring of Evasion [+2]
r) a Garnet Ring {rF}
s) a Round Shield [+0,1d3]
t) a Longsword (Defender) (+0,2d6) [+2] 3.0 lb
   It cannot be harmed by the elements.  
u) a Mattock (-5,5d2) <+2> 11.0 lb
   It improves your tunneling by 2.  It requires both hands to
   wield it properly.  
v) 90 Arrows
   They can be shot 20 squares (with your current strength and bow).


  [Abilities]

Power
Charge
Momentum
Flaming Arrows
Dexterity
Dodging
Flanking
Weaponsmith


  [Enemies]

 11 / 21  Wolf                                    
  1 /  7  Tanglethorn                             
  8 /  8  Orc                                     
  3 /  3  Grimhawk                                
  8 /  8  Orc scout                               
 15 / 15  Spider hatchling                        
  2 /  2  Blue serpent                            
  8 / 12  Orc soldier                             
  3 /  5  Madthorn                                
  9 /  9  Gorcrow                                 
 11 / 11  Orc archer                              
 23 / 24  White wolf                              
  5 /  6  Red serpent                             
  (slain) Gorgol, the Butcher 
 30 / 41  Orc warrior                             
  6 /  6  Sword spider                            
 27 / 27  Crebain                                 
  1 /  1  Mewlip                                  
  2 /  3  Orc thief                               
  6 /  6  Green serpent                           
  9 / 10  Mountain troll                          
  4 /  4  Tattered wight                          
  3 /  4  Orc champion                            
 18 / 23  Easterling warrior                      
 12 / 12  Hummerhorn                              
  3 /  3  Orc captain                             
 23 / 29  Warg                                    
  3 /  3  Grave wight                             
  2 /  2  Dark serpent                            
  (slain) Orcobal, Champion of the Orcs 
 34 / 45  Whispering shadow                       
 15 / 15  Distended spider                        
  9 /  9  Easterling archer                       
  (slain) Othrod, the Orc Lord 
 12 / 12  Snow troll                              
  7 / 11  Giant                                   
  9 / 10  Easterling spy                          
  2 /  4  Shadow bat                              
 10 / 10  Sulrauko                                
  1 /  2  Fire-drake hatchling                    
  (slain) Ulfang the Black 
  8 / 10  Werewolf                                
  0 /  3  Shadow spider                           
  2 /  2  Shadow                                  
  (slain) Gilim, the Giant of Eruman 
  3 /  3  Ruby serpent                            
  6 /  6  Ringrauko                               
  (slain) Delthaur, Balrog of Terror 
  (slain) Nan, the Giant 
  2 /  2  Cave troll                              
  2 /  2  Cat warrior                             


  [Notes]

Brut of the Noldor
Entered Angband on 19 Oct 2016

   Turn     Depth   Note

      0     50 ft   (Power)
    241     50 ft   Found The Pair of Boots of Finrod
    634    100 ft   (Weaponsmith)
    650    100 ft   Made a Longbow (+0,2d5)  3.0 lb
    711    100 ft   Made a Mattock (-5,5d2) <+2>  11.0 lb
    721    100 ft   Made 24 Arrows  2.4 lb
  3,754    350 ft   Encountered Gorgol, the Butcher
  3,782    350 ft   Slew Gorgol, the Butcher
  6,890    500 ft   Found The Glaive of Gaurin
  7,088    500 ft   Encountered Orcobal, Champion of the Orcs
  7,167    500 ft   Slew Orcobal, Champion of the Orcs
  7,489    500 ft   (Flaming Arrows)
  7,489    500 ft   (Dexterity)
  7,658    500 ft   Encountered Othrod, the Orc Lord
  7,676    500 ft   Slew Othrod, the Orc Lord
  8,705    550 ft   Encountered Ulfang the Black
  8,721    550 ft   Slew Ulfang the Black
  8,898    550 ft   (Charge)
  8,898    550 ft   (Momentum)
  8,898    550 ft   (Dodging)
  8,898    550 ft   (Flanking)
  9,572    600 ft   Encountered Nan, the Giant
  9,584    600 ft   Slew Nan, the Giant
  9,584    600 ft   Found The Greatsword 'Glend'
 11,183    600 ft   Encountered Delthaur, Balrog of Terror
 11,269    600 ft   Destroyed Delthaur, Balrog of Terror
 11,269    600 ft   Found The Studded Leather of Aegnor
 11,329    600 ft   Encountered Gilim, the Giant of Eruman
 11,343    600 ft   Slew Gilim, the Giant of Eruman
  ['Score' 013087723]
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