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Old May 21, 2013, 23:47   #51
Zyphyr
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Originally Posted by eMeM View Post
I think I'm repeating myself. Hobbit mage (7HP) with disconnected stairs.
Disconnected Stairs is an option. Experienced players may chose it for the extra challenge. New players shouldn't be changing options, and if they do they deserve an additional deaths it may cause.
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Old May 22, 2013, 03:53   #52
Feloniousmonk
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Originally Posted by Starhawk View Post
Getting killed on DL1 costs you, what, five minutes of gameplay? Reroll a new character and do it over again. It's not worth the time you're spending arguing about it.
Pretty much this. Dying on DL 70 is way, way more aggravating than dying 2 minutes into the game. If you're having that much trouble on level one I suggest you look at your playing style.
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Old May 22, 2013, 05:22   #53
Timo Pietilš
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Originally Posted by eMeM View Post
I think I'm repeating myself. Hobbit mage (7HP) with disconnected stairs. I have seen rooms with two packs of jackals. You can start surrounded by all of them.
Can, but have you actually? As very first clvl? I have played this game for about two decades now and I don't recall that happening me ever. If I'm surrounded by pack monsters in beginning of the level my first reaction is to bail out of that situation with phase door if I don't have anything better to use. Jackals and cave spiders start asleep and don't have impossible low alertness rating, in fact none of the dlvl 50' group monsters are "ever vigilant", so you can quite easily escape with hobbit mage. H-Troll warrior would have bigger trouble, but OTOH H-Troll warrior probably could actually fight them.

Worst case I can think of is to get both Grip and Fang at starting room with you, but that too has never happened to me.
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Old May 22, 2013, 05:49   #54
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Right, if there were an indication that no-win scenarios happened a reasonable percentage of the time on L1 of the dungeon under the default options then I'd be in favor of a fix.

The fact that I've never seen such a position and that it needs to have an option set which makes the game harder for it to occur tells me it isn't something that needs to be dealt with.
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Old May 22, 2013, 09:18   #55
eMeM
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Originally Posted by Feloniousmonk View Post
If you're having that much trouble on level one I suggest you look at your playing style.
I have posted stats with number of OOD monsters which clearly states that 50' level is much harder than anything else in the game. Is it enough to say I'm poor player? Man, please don't use this topic for personal attacks just because you don't agree with me.
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Old May 22, 2013, 09:27   #56
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I have posted stats with number of OOD monsters which clearly states that 50' level is much harder than anything else in the game.
By this argument, level 98 is the easiest level in the game, because everything is from at least 3 dungeon levels less. How about we just swap the positions of the two? Problem solved!
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Old May 22, 2013, 09:33   #57
eMeM
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Originally Posted by Oramin View Post
Right, if there were an indication that no-win scenarios happened a reasonable percentage of the time on L1 of the dungeon under the default options then I'd be in favor of a fix.
With connected stairs there's no such thing as no-win scenario. We can always run away before any monster moves if we don't like generated level. And play on 50' depth until we get 50 level char with good gear. Nothing force us to attack monsters that can harm us, nothing force us to play in dangerous environment, nothing forces us to take a step out from being safe on stairs. This might take long but game allows that. I would say connected stairs makes Angband solved, of course in real life no one wants to play that way even borg is programmed to take more risks.
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Old May 22, 2013, 09:39   #58
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By this argument, level 98 is the easiest level in the game, because everything is from at least 3 dungeon levels less. How about we just swap the positions of the two? Problem solved!
And that's what it is, 98,99,100 and so on are very easy levels. IMO written many times here, there is no way to die there unless someone makes serious mistake (doesn't heal/doesn't destruct/doesn't banish/doesn't teleport other/ doesn't stay out of LOS in danger).

In ZAngband there were few over 100 level monsters
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Old May 22, 2013, 10:02   #59
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Originally Posted by eMeM View Post
I have posted stats with number of OOD monsters which clearly states that 50' level is much harder than anything else in the game. Is it enough to say I'm poor player? Man, please don't use this topic for personal attacks just because you don't agree with me.
Really? I haven't seen any posts with stats that could be used to make such conclusion. The only post with stats I saw did show that dlvl 1 had a lot less monsters than later levels which means that it is easiest.
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Old May 22, 2013, 10:41   #60
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Just recently we've had a change with monster pit size. There are lot of monsters that can't do any harm to our hero. And other can't do either, we just have to face them one by one not all at same time. I don't think numbers make deeper dungeon levels any harder because by then we can kill any number of them with 0% risk of death.
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