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Old September 10, 2011, 13:55   #21
nppangband
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Timo Pietilš View Post
I did mean it as telling what has been done, and how that is an error. Blue Wizards is not general name of Ainur, it means two wizards that are part of Istari and those combined is just five unique beings, not a general name of a species/race. You can't use something that means known monsters as general monster names, that's like using ringwraiths as just one type of wraith in the game, no matter how many you kill, there will be others.
I took a little bit of artistic license there. The two blue wizards went east, and were never heard from again. Even Tolkien stated he did not know what thier fate was. I just assumed they started their own order and trained many others in thier ways.

It isn't without precedent. Tolkien once wrote that only 7 balrogs exist, but Angband has unique balrogs and a generic monster races.

ALso, I noted when I posted the patch that the list wasn't perfect. I am sure if you ask 100 Angband players, you will get 100 different lists of maiar/ainur that should go in the game. The devteam requested when I did the patch that I try to keep things aligned so the Angel tiles, while not perfect, at least be usable and make reasonable sense for the new monsters. That's why the changes are the way they are.

In NPP that list has since been replaced with 40+ ainur/maiar monster raced in NPP. By the way, the Encylopedia of Adra is now pretty well organized for research of they kind now. I think I will add a couple more to NPP sometime soon.

http://www.glyphweb.com/arda/raceainu.html
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Old September 11, 2011, 15:57   #22
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should this one be replaced with something else as well, when we're in the process of purging earth-religious creatures from Angband:


N:436:Knight Templar
Terson
D:It seems that the more devout the person, the more likely they are to cross
D: the boundary between piety and sanctimoniousness. And such is the case with
D: the Order of the Knights Templar; they are among the most pious and powerful
D: of the religious knightly orders, but noted for their intolerance. Thus it
D: is Morgoth's will that is unwittingly done, as the forces of good are set
D: against each other.
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Old September 11, 2011, 16:39   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shockbolt View Post
should this one be replaced with something else as well, when we're in the process of purging earth-religious creatures from Angband:


N:436:Knight Templar
Terson
D:It seems that the more devout the person, the more likely they are to cross
D: the boundary between piety and sanctimoniousness. And such is the case with
D: the Order of the Knights Templar; they are among the most pious and powerful
D: of the religious knightly orders, but noted for their intolerance. Thus it
D: is Morgoth's will that is unwittingly done, as the forces of good are set
D: against each other.
probably should be changed before 3.4 for thematic consistency. Some human who is a devotee of the maia.
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Old September 11, 2011, 16:50   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shockbolt View Post
should this one be replaced with something else as well, when we're in the process of purging earth-religious creatures from Angband
Nearly all (unique) creatures in Angband that are not Tolkien creation are from some religion, starting from Titans. What we are now doing is just removing major religion creatures. IIRC removal of Tiamat was because it is religious creature. Same with Cerberus.

Angels are just entire race that is religious so that doesn't feel like they should be there. BTW if we remove angels we should remove Pit Fiends as well. They don't feel "right" anyway in set where greater Balrogs should be the most powerul beings.

I wouldn't mind if we remove Knight Templars completely. They are after all quite boring creatures. Just boost Paladins a bit to compensate the loss of one step up creature of same set.
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Old September 11, 2011, 17:11   #25
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If you choose to embrace mythical creatures under the religious wings then yes. What I put behind the meaning of the word religion in here, is Christianity or any other major religion out there today, represented by angels, cherubs and lastly spotted: Templar Knights. And I named them earth-religious for the sake of simplicity. In the same way we wouldn't want Muhammed running around in here, or a bunch of old indian gods for that matter.

Gorgons, Titans, Werewolves, Werebears, Colossus and whatnot that are represented in "ancient earth" religions and myths, these I wouldn't bother changing, as they blend well into the fantasy setting.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Timo Pietilš View Post
Nearly all (unique) creatures in Angband that are not Tolkien creation are from some religion, starting from Titans. What we are now doing is just removing major religion creatures. IIRC removal of Tiamat was because it is religious creature. Same with Cerberus.

Angels are just entire race that is religious so that doesn't feel like they should be there. BTW if we remove angels we should remove Pit Fiends as well. They don't feel "right" anyway in set where greater Balrogs should be the most powerul beings.

I wouldn't mind if we remove Knight Templars completely. They are after all quite boring creatures. Just boost Paladins a bit to compensate the loss of one step up creature of same set.
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Old September 12, 2011, 19:08   #26
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why change it lol, nn 4 athiest band or crying, nn 4 crying 2 tolkien either,

not 2 dis u or anything sorry but its good as it is!
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Old September 12, 2011, 19:27   #27
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can someone translate that first part into understandable english please

It has nothing to do being an atheist or not, these creatures simply don't belong in Angband, that's why I suggested them to be replaced. I'm not the one calling the shots, but I'm pretty happy with them being replaced by more "appropriate" creatures

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why change it lol, nn 4 athiest band or crying, nn 4 crying 2 tolkien either,

not 2 dis u or anything sorry but its good as it is!
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Last edited by Shockbolt; September 12, 2011 at 19:32.
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Old September 12, 2011, 19:33   #28
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It doesn't matter. Click on "dos350", Click "User Lists" and finally click "Add to Ignore List". You won't be missing anything.
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Old September 12, 2011, 19:34   #29
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I think he just means "don't make changes!"

Maybe just change the name and description of Knight Templar to something like "White Knight". In Numenor they had a shrine to Eru so you could come up with some kind of numenorean knighthood (maybe a faction of the Rangers, though 'ranger' is already taken in Angband).
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Old September 12, 2011, 19:37   #30
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I second that suggestion for the Templar Knight replacement.

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Originally Posted by EpicMan View Post
I think he just means "don't make changes!"

Maybe just change the name and description of Knight Templar to something like "White Knight". In Numenor they had a shrine to Eru so you could come up with some kind of numenorean knighthood (maybe a faction of the Rangers, though 'ranger' is already taken in Angband).
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