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Old February 11, 2014, 17:18   #31
HallucinationMushroom
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielKennethRego View Post
I had no knowledge of this O-style combat you speak of. Can you elaborate? Also, does NPP definitely not have this? I'm quite intrigued.
Hopefully someone better informed will clarify and clean this up, but, roughly, this is how they differ in example form...

Yeah, NPP will behave like vanilla. So, a 1d4 (+20, +30) dagger does 1d4+30 damage every time it hits, not counting for criticals. The damage bonus number is usually what drives damage in V combat. Stacking the todamage number and attacking multiple times. The damage dice are often secondary.

In O-style combat, the damage dice drive the damage. The todamage number is replaced by increased deadliness. A 1d4 (+20, +30) dagger isn't going to do 1d4+30 damage per hit. The +30 would go toward your deadliness. For example, if you had an overall deadliness bonus of 100%, you would be doing double damage with your weapon... in this case, 1d4*2. It makes large damage dice weapons... 1d13 pikes, 3d6 swords, 4d5's, etc. etc. etc. much more attractive. Since criticals let you roll extra damage sides, (like in Sil), having a weapon that has large dice, but maybe lower average damage, is worth considering if you crit a lot. Like, a 1d10 rapier versus a 2d5 longsword, for example.
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Old February 13, 2014, 12:27   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by taptap View Post
@ Sil, but with magic.

I just want to note for the record, Sil has magic, subtle yet powerful. You really should play a singer to experience it. Holding a Balrog paralysed and powerless with your voice alone (especially if you field no fighting capabilities to talk of), that is true magic and at least for me way cooler than "magical artillery" that boils down to damage per turn.
Glad to hear it is working!
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Old February 14, 2014, 03:46   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HallucinationMushroom View Post
Since criticals let you roll extra damage sides, (like in Sil), having a weapon that has large dice, but maybe lower average damage, is worth considering if you crit a lot. Like, a 1d10 rapier versus a 2d5 longsword, for example.
You mean extra damage *dice*? Because it seems to me that 2d6 beats 1d11, though 2d10 beats 3d5...
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Old February 18, 2014, 20:26   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ekolis View Post
You mean extra damage *dice*? Because it seems to me that 2d6 beats 1d11, though 2d10 beats 3d5...
O-combat is quite a bit more complex than V combat. In general 1d11 does beat 2d6 because of the added damage from criticals. All we basically need to remember is that in V it's all about #blows and +dam, with dice a distant third and +hit totally irrelevant, while in O it's all about dice and +skill (for crits), with +dam a distant third. O doesn't have fractional blows, and +blows is much rarer.

(The picture is complicated further by the fact that variants using O-combat are usually significantly harder than V, so missing really counts, and you can't just hold down the move key until it's dead ...)
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Old February 19, 2014, 07:24   #35
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I mean 2d6 as an upgrade from 2d5 beats 1d11 as an upgrade from 1d10, since the bonus side gets rolled twice. Hence my comment about extra damage dice, and not sides, because if you had extra damage dice, and not sides, you'd have 2d10 vs. 3d5, with 2d10 winning the day.
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Old February 19, 2014, 16:29   #36
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Im sorry, forgot to check in on this thread. Yes, my mistake in wording... I should have said dice. A 1d9 spear that double crits will be 3d9, not 1d11
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Old February 22, 2014, 09:39   #37
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FAangband have fractional blows, and +blow does not exist btw.

Also crits adds 2 or 3 or 4 dice with an average about 1 dice every hit for an end-game warrior (up to 1.2 per hit with armsman and uber gear). So 1d11 is effectively 2d11, and 3d3 is 4d3 at average.

Also due to combat system. bonuses to hit are valuable, and may be more valuable than bonuses to deadliness.
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Old February 27, 2014, 14:47   #38
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Seems like I need to check out FAngband...
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Old March 2, 2014, 19:20   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielKennethRego View Post
Also, where do the new Angband releases (3.5 and v4) fall in this scheme?
v4 was the developers testing out ideas. It is not a completed game.

3.5 is the latest Vanilla. There are far less rectangular rooms this time about.
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