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Old December 29, 2015, 17:52   #11
Ingwe Ingweron
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Derakon View Post
I made a quick stab at modifying 4.x to add a class that could cast both holy and divine magic, since that's the big limitation on class abilities. Unfortunately it doesn't seem to be possible. It seems like a given class can only have one 'magic' line in their definition, which is restricted to either arcane or holy magic (those concepts being hardcoded into the game). So you can't have a class that uses INT to cast mage spells and WIS to cast priest spells. I also tried just copying the spell entries from the Mage class into the Priest class (all of the 'book', 'spell', 'effect', etc. entries) so that they could cast mage spells while using WIS as their cast stat, and the game segfaults on launch; see this crash log.

Oh well.
Actually, this is only half-right. You can modify 4.x class files (and p-race files, for that matter) to achieve a jack-of-all trades. You can even cast both mage spells and priest spells, simply by adding the relevant spells to the class file and modifying the object file for the books to contain the number of spells needed (or make new spell books with the number of spells and modify the spell lines in the class file to refer to the new books). It is true that you can only choose one "magic-realm", but this affects only which stat will determine the number of Spell Points and what stat failure rates and new spell level gains are based upon.

It works, I've done it before. Just to see if it was possible, I made a "super-race" (Valar), adding it to the p-Race file. It had all the best flags and stats of all the other races. Then I made a "super-class" (Istari), adding it to the class file. It had all the best flags and stats of all the other classes as well as cherry-picked spells from both mage and priest spells/prayers. Had to choose a realm for SP (Int). I also made the "Istari" spells appear for use only by them in two new books (which they have from the start), by modifying the object file to add the books (Valar Morghulis and Valar Dohaeris) to which the Istari spells in the modified class file point. Oh, and as part of adding the Valar race to the p-race file, also modified the history file to add their birth description, age, and level-up ranks.

Sure, it can be made to work without any crashes whatsoever. But, the balance is so thrown out that the game becomes an exercise in pushing buttons. Fun as an exercise, but boring as a game. I've played a couple other races as an "Istari" using the two new spell-books, and it is somewhat better balanced, but only somewhat. Nonetheless, it is entirely possible to add, say, healing spells to a Ranger and have it work.
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Old December 29, 2015, 18:05   #12
Ingwe Ingweron
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If anyone wants to try the Valar/Istari super-race/class, just unzip these files to the main player directory (the same place as the lore.txt file) and, thanks to Nick's foresight, they will override the files in the gamedata directory. It contains edited class, p-race, object, and history files which add the Valar race/history, Istari class, and two Istari class specific spell books. Just roll-up your new @ and choose Valar and Istari. You start with the books and a great kit, but 0 gold, so just go down the stairs and start playing.

But, like I said, fun as an exercise, boring as a game.

super race-class.zip

Edit: Oh, and I suggest balancing your @ stats to spread the points across everything but Wisdom.
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Last edited by Ingwe Ingweron; December 29, 2015 at 18:12.
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Old December 29, 2015, 19:00   #13
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Okay, I guess I just didn't put enough effort into it, then.

My plan was to create a class with all of the restrictions of the other classes, so e.g. blessed weapons only, can't wear normal gloves, 4 blows/round, no stat modifiers, only average skills. That seems more likely to make a fun experience than giving the player a superpowered race and superpowered class, because you actually need the versatility that dual-casting gives you to be able to keep up.
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Old December 29, 2015, 20:14   #14
Ingwe Ingweron
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Derakon View Post
Okay, I guess I just didn't put enough effort into it, then.

My plan was to create a class with all of the restrictions of the other classes, so e.g. blessed weapons only, can't wear normal gloves, 4 blows/round, no stat modifiers, only average skills. That seems more likely to make a fun experience than giving the player a superpowered race and superpowered class, because you actually need the versatility that dual-casting gives you to be able to keep up.
Easy enough to do. Just modify the super-race "Valar" in the p-race and history files for your new race (using human stats info and the worst skills and flags from the other races and whatever history you want to change) and modify the super-class "Istari" in the class file (using the worst class flags and skills of the other classes). Change the names Valar and Istari to whatever you want. The spells fail rates, mana cost, etc., are from the Mage and Priest varieties, if you want them to reflect the worst of the other classes, you will need to modify each spell entry. If you want them to be in other books, you will have to modify that also.
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Old December 29, 2015, 22:26   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ingwe Ingweron View Post
It works, I've done it before. Just to see if it was possible, I made a "super-race" (Valar), adding it to the p-Race file. It had all the best flags and stats of all the other races. Then I made a "super-class" (Istari), adding it to the class file. It had all the best flags and stats of all the other classes as well as cherry-picked spells from both mage and priest spells/prayers. Had to choose a realm for SP (Int). I also made the "Istari" spells appear for use only by them in two new books (which they have from the start), by modifying the object file to add the books (Valar Morghulis and Valar Dohaeris) to which the Istari spells in the modified class file point. Oh, and as part of adding the Valar race to the p-race file, also modified the history file to add their birth description, age, and level-up ranks.
Brilliant. This was exactly the intention of the current setup - well, really to enable making sensible, balanced classes, but that's just nit-picking

I did actually consider allowing multiple realms as well, but in the end decided to get it properly working with only one realm possible, and generalise later if it seemed necessary.

It's possible that you could get a class which satisfied what the OP was outlining. I feel like you'd basically want to take the worst from all the other classes - add all the restrictive flags, and give generally fairly bad skill modifiers, but then give it a bunch of hitpoints. But that's all just guesswork.
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Old December 30, 2015, 04:15   #16
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Try an Adventurer on TomeNET. They have quite a lot of freedom with their skill selection.
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Old December 30, 2015, 15:02   #17
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You might also want to look at PosChengBand for creating this class. Since it is already set up with a system that allows multiple spell realms per class, it should be easiest to do what you want.
On the other hand, it has even more options available overall, so getting access to everything is more work, and a lot more requires actual code changes.
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Old December 30, 2015, 20:14   #18
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Or really, just go and play Crawl.
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