The horror ad the hope

Moving Pictures · June 6, 2018, 01:33

So after misplaying my poor half-orc paladin, I've gone back. Multiple low level deaths, including mercenary and cat on 0.

List of dead includes Kobold mage at about CL7; H/O warrior at Cl2, etc. the usual. A half-troll mage landed afoul of a scroll of deep descent early level 2 and held out admirably at DL 7 that measured a 6-x, but ultimately faded.

But I've got a live one with Butrkup, a dumb-as-a-stump H/T paladin. She's already found ESP and has the four elemental resists, and hasn't hit DL20 yet. FD with recall. In the last two levels, Brodda, Golfimbul, Bullroarer, Grishnakh, Orfax and Nar were little more then speedbumps. Ibun was a bit of a challenge, requiring a few PDs to defeat (so as to avoid Disenchantment.)

The early ESP find early in DL 18 has proven a huge game-changer. Fascinating, given that the last major dive didn't get ESP until what, DL60 or something? Only issue is that ESP comes off a whimpy little dagger, so I see a swap-weapon thing in my future.

All that makes me want to know: how critical are early game finds like that to long-term success?

PS: One obvious trait: I think @ has gone through at least one cloak per level, or thereabouts, due to acid. And that's *with* rAcid since about DL6 or so.

Transcendental number · June 6, 2018, 03:09

Speaking as someone who is just relearning things after a long absence I'd say early game finds lead to a more fun experience... for a while. But they don't contribute to long-term survivability because they make you soft.

I just got my first winner in this iteration of Angband and it was a grind all the way. I never felt comfortable (until right at the end). But that is why my paranoid Gnome Mage turned out a winner rather than a chicken dinner. Earlier attempts had died from overconfidence - usually related to some early great find.

Pete Mack · June 6, 2018, 04:01

Early ESP is arguably the biggest gamechanger for a warrior (Or priest caster.) Otherwise, early speed is tops. Big damage is next, but adequate damage is pretty common.

Moving Pictures · June 6, 2018, 12:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete Mack

Early ESP is arguably the biggest gamechanger for a warrior (Or priest caster.) Otherwise, early speed is tops. Big damage is next, but adequate damage is pretty common.

What really got me was the difference in how I managed Ibun with ESP compared to the previous paladin that got that far. The previous bloke had some serious challenges and burned through a lot more consumables to avoid the disenchant. In Butrkup's case, she could sense the incoming, drop speed, and fire off several crossbow bolts then PD and repeat.

Just knowing - dynamically - what's coming at you, is such a tactical plus. I mean detects give you a sense of "oh, there's a vampire out there, in this area," but being able to gain the "it's three squares away, behind Ulfang, so instead of using my crossbow on Ulfang, I will take this turn to step back so that I'm in a corridor where it can't get me, then, after I mash Ulfang, I should immediately PD to gain space ..."

Pete Mack · June 6, 2018, 17:24

A combination of mapping, illumination, and light rods in hallways (and infravison) makes a pretty good "poor man's ESP". It certainly helps archery.

ESP is good for everything really dangerous except drolems and Quylthugs, and shriekers. For those, you need full detection.

Sphara · June 6, 2018, 21:52

Pete did put it there.

I'll add just one thing:

Stay the fuck out of dragon summon traps.
Those show up relatively early and when you trigger them, not only you can get some out-of-depth dragons, they also get to act immediately.

Instadeaths are real in Angband. This dragon trap was new to me. DO NOT TRY TO DISARM ONE OF THOSE, if you want to win the game.

PowerWyrm · June 7, 2018, 08:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sphara

Pete did put it there.

I'll add just one thing:

Stay the fuck out of dragon summon traps.
Those show up relatively early and when you trigger them, not only you can get some out-of-depth dragons, they also get to act immediately.

Instadeaths are real in Angband. This dragon trap was new to me. DO NOT TRY TO DISARM ONE OF THOSE, if you want to win the game.

Same goes for demon traps. Getting a gelugon/pit fiend/greater balrog combo that will breathe shards/chaos/fire instantly is not a good idea...

Moving Pictures · June 7, 2018, 12:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sphara

Pete did put it there.

I'll add just one thing:

Stay the **** out of dragon summon traps..

I lost a particularly potent-looking character - half-orc fighter ironman I was writing diaries about, IIRC, to exactly that. Multi-hued dragon didn't kill outright, but chased @ all over a dungeon, draining consumables that led to a death a level or two below.

Moving Pictures · June 10, 2018, 02:41

Butrkup has found Wrath ... I think I'm getting the hang of the diving thing (forced descent, but with recall on). Just bumped to 50 at DL 83.

1126 hit points,
401 spell points
Ac 201
Speed 23 native.

Time to gather banishments, runes, and maybe a better whompum-upside-head weapon.

June 6, 2018, 01:33	#1
Moving Pictures Adept Join Date: Mar 2018 Posts: 191	The horror and the hope So after misplaying my poor half-orc paladin, I've gone back. Multiple low level deaths, including mercenary and cat on 0. List of dead includes Kobold mage at about CL7; H/O warrior at Cl2, etc. the usual. A half-troll mage landed afoul of a scroll of deep descent early level 2 and held out admirably at DL 7 that measured a 6-x, but ultimately faded. But I've got a live one with Butrkup, a dumb-as-a-stump H/T paladin. She's already found ESP and has the four elemental resists, and hasn't hit DL20 yet. FD with recall. In the last two levels, Brodda, Golfimbul, Bullroarer, Grishnakh, Orfax and Nar were little more then speedbumps. Ibun was a bit of a challenge, requiring a few PDs to defeat (so as to avoid Disenchantment.) The early ESP find early in DL 18 has proven a huge game-changer. Fascinating, given that the last major dive didn't get ESP until what, DL60 or something? Only issue is that ESP comes off a whimpy little dagger, so I see a swap-weapon thing in my future. All that makes me want to know: how critical are early game finds like that to long-term success? PS: One obvious trait: I think @ has gone through at least one cloak per level, or thereabouts, due to acid. And that's with rAcid since about DL6 or so. Last edited by Moving Pictures; June 6, 2018 at 16:27.

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June 6, 2018, 03:09	#2
Transcendental number Rookie Join Date: Jun 2018 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 2	Speaking as someone who is just relearning things after a long absence I'd say early game finds lead to a more fun experience... for a while. But they don't contribute to long-term survivability because they make you soft. I just got my first winner in this iteration of Angband and it was a grind all the way. I never felt comfortable (until right at the end). But that is why my paranoid Gnome Mage turned out a winner rather than a chicken dinner. Earlier attempts had died from overconfidence - usually related to some early great find.

June 6, 2018, 04:01	#3
Pete Mack Prophet Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 6,191 Donated: $40	Early ESP is arguably the biggest gamechanger for a warrior (Or priest caster.) Otherwise, early speed is tops. Big damage is next, but adequate damage is pretty common.

June 6, 2018, 17:24	#5
Pete Mack Prophet Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 6,191 Donated: $40	A combination of mapping, illumination, and light rods in hallways (and infravison) makes a pretty good "poor man's ESP". It certainly helps archery. ESP is good for everything really dangerous except drolems and Quylthugs, and shriekers. For those, you need full detection.

June 6, 2018, 21:52	#6
Sphara Swordsman Join Date: Oct 2016 Location: Finland Posts: 424	Pete did put it there. I'll add just one thing: Stay the fuck out of dragon summon traps. Those show up relatively early and when you trigger them, not only you can get some out-of-depth dragons, they also get to act immediately. Instadeaths are real in Angband. This dragon trap was new to me. DO NOT TRY TO DISARM ONE OF THOSE, if you want to win the game.

June 10, 2018, 02:41	#9
Moving Pictures Adept Join Date: Mar 2018 Posts: 191	Butrkup has found Wrath ... I think I'm getting the hang of the diving thing (forced descent, but with recall on). Just bumped to 50 at DL 83. 1126 hit points, 401 spell points Ac 201 Speed 23 native. Time to gather banishments, runes, and maybe a better whompum-upside-head weapon.

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