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Old July 13, 2020, 20:48   #41
archolewa
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Slightly off topic, but I actually enjoy the food system in Nethack. I feel like its interaction with corpses, and the simulationist flavor it gives works well with the rest of the game, which really feels more like a dungeon survival game than a hack'n'slash dungeon crawl.

Angband *is* a hack'n'slash dungeon crawl though, so I understand the dislike for it in Angband.

I'd probably keep food on personally, but that's the joy of birth options. One thing I appreciate in Frogcomposband is the wealth of birth options that allow you to tailor the game to your tastes. I have no problem with Angband having a similar plethora of customizations.
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Old July 13, 2020, 20:52   #42
DavidMedley
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Quote:
Originally Posted by licker View Post
Why do you have to remove all food items?

Just leave them in the game but make the meter have zero effect no matter where it is.
Right. So we're back to "I want to chug unlimited cure potions with zero fail rate and no limiting factors beyond those that afflict all items (weight, space, cost)."
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Old July 13, 2020, 22:53   #43
whartung
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Originally Posted by DavidMedley View Post
Right. So we're back to "I want to chug unlimited cure potions with zero fail rate and no limiting factors beyond those that afflict all items (weight, space, cost)."
Yes, I'd miss the C[LSC]W potions. I don't put them in the same category as the foods and mushrooms, though at a meta level they're all identical. Consumables that "heal" something.

And they do have a cost -- they cost time, typically when time matters. They take an action. Can't just put your finger up against the monsters bashing you and say "Hang on while I quaff 20 healing pots kthx".

That's what gives them limited utility. They're also rare (for assorted values of "rare", only CLW is effectively unlimited, but also not worth carrying) and in limited supply.

In my experience most fight as melee when I need to be quaffing healing pots, the pots barely heal enough to keep me in the game. I take them in the hope I'll get enough to get another action. Do I drink a healing pot, or blink. And it's not always obvious which is the better option at the time.

Similarly, more than once I was slamming down 1/2 dozen pots as the monster(s) were closing in on me after I blinked away getting ready for another go. I save CSW for such antics of rapid recovery. Better to buff up than stick 'em with arrows. Of course, these are the situations where you should be thinking hard about just leaving, but at the same time, you may have just arrived.

Simply, for me, the food mechanic is needless housekeeping. It's toil.

If it's meant to be a mechanic to limit healing pots, then, fine, but that mechanic doesn't seem to happen until very late in the game (apparently). Long time to drag it around. It could be mitigated by limiting the inventory of something like *Healing* pots.
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Old July 14, 2020, 04:42   #44
mrfy
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It's not that difficult to manage food intake. I like the new system and the variety of options that were added. I would argue against making it a birth option.
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Old July 14, 2020, 06:33   #45
Saru
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I think there are decent arguments for both sides. Maybe a more meaningful limiting factor on healing potions could be to temporarily reduce the effectiveness of consuming too many potions at once? Something like the first potion heals 100% of it's value, then the next 85%, etc.... That way you could down a potion or two, then have to wait a little while for their impact to go back up. Numbers would have to be tweaked, but I feel that this could reflect in a somewhat logical way how the character's body might not respond as effectively to the millionth potion within a short time.

Or, something like gradual negative effects that could build up from drinking too many potions too quickly, eg minor to severe slowing, temporary impaired hp or stats, something to represent nausea after potion overdose?

Just some ill thought out suggestions though; likely would add unnecessary complication to the development end as well.
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Old July 14, 2020, 16:22   #46
licker
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Originally Posted by DavidMedley View Post
Right. So we're back to "I want to chug unlimited cure potions with zero fail rate and no limiting factors beyond those that afflict all items (weight, space, cost)."
Sure?

Because that has never been an issue for me anyway. It's just a question of how you micro your food level with eating and resting.

If that's the only reason you have then you have a really really bad reason.

Though I honestly do not care if people want to carry 40 of each pot and chug them as much as they like. Why do you care? Angband is just not a 'YOU HAVE TO PLAY THIS GAME MY WAY' kind of game. Which is why I advocate making it a birth option.

Further, if it is an issue for one particular class then my argument is that the class needs a change. Just stick a limit on how many !s a Blackguard can drink. Make them have diminishing returns, cap it, whatever. Frankly, I don't like Blackguards anyway, they don't feel right to me, but I'm not going to tell anyone not to play them, and I don't really care if they are easier or harder because of a food/no food option. Already different classes are easier or harder due to various in game mechanics, I don't think anyone is worried about that.
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