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Old November 12, 2011, 17:36   #1
PowerWyrm
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There are only scraps of junk here...

1250ft, moving 3 squares left after getting the feeling, Long Sword on the ground revealed to be Ringil on pickup...

Scraps of junk? What the hell?
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Old November 12, 2011, 19:36   #2
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Hmmm. That's not ideal. What version?
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Old November 12, 2011, 20:58   #3
Fendell Orcbane
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PowerWyrm View Post
1250ft, moving 3 squares left after getting the feeling, Long Sword on the ground revealed to be Ringil on pickup...

Scraps of junk? What the hell?
Yeah sometimes I've found really good stuff on levels like that as well.
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Old November 12, 2011, 21:20   #4
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Old November 12, 2011, 22:53   #5
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Hmmm. That's not ideal. What version?
I think the problem is that Ringil is rated as a dlevel 20 item. I've noticed that the feelings are fairly iffy still.
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Old November 13, 2011, 07:33   #6
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Quote:
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I think the problem is that Ringil is rated as a dlevel 20 item.
That shouldn't matter, as the feeling should be calculated on the basis of the sum of object values for all floor objects. Ringil won't get any extra value points from being OOD at dl20, but it's still hugely valuable and that should be reflected in the feeling.

I've noticed that feelings tend to be consistently low - is that your experience? I wonder if there is something buggy about the calculation, and values are not being added up properly. Or if they are just wrongly calibrated.

If other people notice unduly high feelings too, then we have a different problem.
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Old November 13, 2011, 15:31   #7
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I've noticed that feelings tend to be consistently low - is that your experience? I wonder if there is something buggy about the calculation, and values are not being added up properly. Or if they are just wrongly calibrated.
Feelings are low. I think summing is the problem. Maybe we want a Euclidean sum sqrt(x1^2 + x2^2 +x3^3 + ...) which will weight feelings more towards the best items on the level. Even one OoD item should guarantee at least a good feeling. Same with any artifact.

Of course we can't use sqrt in the calculation, so it makes things trickier.
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Old November 13, 2011, 16:15   #8
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Originally Posted by fizzix View Post
Maybe we want a Euclidean sum sqrt(x1^2 + x2^2 +x3^2 + ...)
Of course we can't use sqrt in the calculation, so it makes things trickier.
No need to compute square roots: instead of checking if sqrt(F) is between a and b, check that a^2<F<b^2. Your only problem now is overflow, but if you use 32-bit integers you should be safe. Also, you may want to normalize dividing by the number of objects on the level.
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Old November 14, 2011, 12:37   #9
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Hmmm. That's not ideal. What version?
Latest 3.3 release (3.3.2). This happens because preserve mode is on (so no special message for artifacts) and Ringil was the only "good" item generated on the level (no unique, no pit, no vault...). Even considering Ringil's value, it's not enough to boost the rating high enough to pass the "scrap of junk" level at that depth.

Clearly, the rating should weight more single "great" items compared to the sum of a bunch of crap.
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Old November 26, 2011, 23:12   #10
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Seems like it would be good if the feeling generator could take rarity into account (as well as dlvl) when figuring out how much effect an artifact has on feeling. We could argue on exactly how much of one, but a useful case would be figuring out how much a level with only Ringil (e.g. this situation) should be rated.
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