The Angband Ladder: Charge!!!!, Noldor Fingolfin no-class by HallucinationMushroom

  [Sil 1.0.1 Character Dump]

 Name   Charge!!!!    Age       10       Str   6 =  3  +1      +2
 Sex    Male          Height   5'2       Dex   1 =  2          -1
 Race   Noldor        Weight    55       Con  11 =  6  +1      +4
 House  Fingolfin                        Gra   0 =  2  +1  -2  -1

 Game Turn   29,593   Melee (+24,6d11)   Melee       24 = 28  +1  -5
 Exp Pool     1,095   Bows    (+1,0d0)   Archery      1 =  0  +1  -1  +1
 Total Exp   83,395   Armor [+18,7-16]   Evasion     18 = 14  +1  +3
 Burden       112.9                      Stealth      6 =  7  +1  -2
 Max Burden   298.4   Health    -4:148   Perception   7 =  7
 Depth         1000'  Voice      20:20   Will         8 =  7          +1
 Min Depth     1000'                     Smithing     2 =  2
 Light Radius     6                      Song         0 =  0

 Duh duh duh Duh duh Duh!!!! Charge!!!!

  [Last Messages]

> You feel less resistant to fire.
> You hit Morgoth, Lord of Darkness.
> You burst into a furious rage!
> You have a Russet Herb of Rage (a).
> You hit Morgoth, Lord of Darkness.
> You feel more resilient.
> You have 6 Milky White Potions of Constitution (g).
> You hit Morgoth, Lord of Darkness!
> You feel less resistant to cold.
> You have 5 Milky White Potions of Constitution (g).
> You miss Morgoth, Lord of Darkness.
> Morgoth, Lord of Darkness misses you.
> You miss Morgoth, Lord of Darkness.
> Morgoth, Lord of Darkness hits you.
> You die.




a) The Mattock 'Burkfelek' (-4,6d2) <+3> 11.0 lb
   It improves your tunneling by 3.  It cannot be harmed by the
   elements.  It requires both hands to wield it properly.  
b) (nothing)
c) a Beryl Ring of Damage <+1>
   It improves your damage sides by 1.  
d) a Beryl Ring of Damage <+1>
   It improves your damage sides by 1.  
e) The Necklace of the Dwarves <+1>
   It increases your constitution and grace by 1.  It cannot be
   harmed by the elements.  
f) a Silmaril
   It sustains your grace.  It grants you the ability to see
   invisible creatures.  It cannot be harmed by the elements.  
g) a Mail Corslet of Permanence (-1) [-2,2d4]
   It sustains your strength and dexterity.  It cannot be harmed
   by the elements.  
h) a Shadow Cloak of Warmth [+3] <+2>
   It improves your stealth by 2.  It provides resistance to 
   cold.  It creates an unnatural darkness.  
i) (nothing)
j) a Dwarf Mask [-1,1d3]
   It provides resistance to fire.  
k) a Set of Gauntlets of Power [+0,1d1] <+1>
   It increases your strength by 1.  
l) The Pair of Leather Boots of Finrod [+3,1d1]
   It grants you freedom of movement.  It cannot be harmed by
   the elements.  
m) (nothing)
n) (nothing)


a) a Russet Herb of Rage
b) 2 Grey Herbs of Sustenance
c) 2 Wrinkled Herbs of Restoration
d) a Fragment of Lembas
e) 3 Grey Potions of Quickness
f) 2 Azure Potions of Dexterity
g) 5 Milky White Potions of Constitution
h) an Oak Staff of Light (7 charges)
i) an Elm Staff of Revelations (1 charge)
j) a Beech Staff of Recharging (2 charges)
k) 2 Jet Rings of Strength <+1>
   It increases your strength by 1.  It sustains your strength.  
l) a Feanorian Lamp
m) The Kite Shield of Hador (-1) [+0,1d6]
   It provides resistance to cold and fire.  It cannot be harmed
   by the elements.  
n) a Bastard Sword of Rauko Slaying (-2,3d4) [+1] 3.6 lb
   It slays raukar.  It does extra damage when wielded with both
o) a Great Axe (Vampiric) (-3,4d5) 10.2 lb
   It drains life from your enemies.  It increases your hunger.  
   It requires both hands to wield it properly.  
p) a Mattock (-7,6d2) <+2> 16.8 lb
   It improves your tunneling by 2.  It requires both hands to
   wield it properly.  


Charge!!!! of the Noldor
Entered Angband on 26 Jan 2012

    Turn     Depth    Note

       3     50 ft    (Power)
       3     50 ft    (Charge)
   1,076    100 ft    (Weaponsmith)
   4,557    300 ft    (Dodging)
   4,998    350 ft    (Sprinting)
   8,487    450 ft    (Lore-Keeper)
   9,211    450 ft    (Lore-Master)
   9,211    450 ft    Found The Necklace of the Dwarves (from 150 ft)
  10,030    450 ft    Slew Othrond, the Orc Lord
  10,297    450 ft    Slew Orcobal, Champion of the Orcs
  12,146    500 ft    (Blocking)
  12,146    500 ft    (Heavy Armour Use)
  12,614    500 ft    (Keen Senses)
  12,718    500 ft    Slew Gilim, the Giant of Eruman
  13,113    500 ft    Slew Ulfang the Black
  13,218    500 ft    (Clarity)
  13,519    550 ft    (Inner Light)
  13,873    550 ft    Slew Uldor, the Accursed
  14,066    550 ft    (Hardiness)
  14,751    600 ft    (Poison Resistance)
  15,028    600 ft    Found The Kite Shield of Hador
  15,593    700 ft    (Disguise)
  15,593    700 ft    (Exchange Places)
  18,337    700 ft    (Knock Back)
  19,551    750 ft    Found The Pair of Leather Boots of Finrod
  19,559    750 ft    (Mind Over Body)
  21,795    800 ft    (Strength)
  21,852    800 ft    Slew Umuiyan, the Doorkeeper
  23,449    850 ft    Slew Tevildo, Prince of Cats
  23,473    850 ft    Slew Dagorhir, the Elfbane
  25,198    850 ft    Found The Greatsword 'Calris'
  25,272    850 ft    Slew Oikeroi, Guard of Tevildo
  26,374    900 ft    Slew Maeglin, Betrayer of Gondolin
  26,374    900 ft    Found The Galvorn Armour of Maeglin
  27,436    900 ft    Left without entering the Ungoliant's lair
  27,550    950 ft    Found The Mattock 'Burkfelek'
  27,837    950 ft    (Stun)
  28,187    950 ft    Slew Shelob, Spider of Darkness
  29,160  1,000 ft    Entered Morgoth's throne room
  29,221  1,000 ft    Slew Thuringwethil, the Vampire Messenger
  29,235  1,000 ft    Found The Bat-Fell of Thuringwethil
  29,250  1,000 ft    Found The Massive Iron Crown of Morgoth
  29,290  1,000 ft    Destroyed Lungorthin, the Balrog of White Fire
  29,450  1,000 ft    Cut a Silmaril from Morgoth's crown
  29,451  1,000 ft    Found The Massive Iron Crown of Morgoth

  29,593  1,000 ft    Slain by Morgoth, Lord of Darkness.
  29,593  1,000 ft    Died on 27 January 2012.

  ['Score' 020170407]

Posted on 26.1.2012 21:12
Last updated on 28.1.2012 00:55

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355. on the Sil Ladder (of 1286)

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Ungoliant's Web


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On 26.1.2012 21:12 HallucinationMushroom wrote:
Ahh, relief. It's so much easier with Fingolfin's house. First charging character out of the gate is doing great. It doesn't hurt that I've had great luck finding goodies. First Necklace of the Dwarves find ever negates my need to craft that +1 amulet of con that I do so love to make. The gauntlets of power are nice to, and the long corslet is very heavy, which is good. The charge mechanic is very powerful and really helps with the frequent combat situation where a bunch of baddies line up at the end of the corridor and try to gang up on you. While they still get their attacks, they are more than happy to let you retreat back into the corridor over and over again for many repeated charges for nice damage. I'm eager to see if Knockback coupled with charge would let me kill big big baddies, like Demogorgon.

On 27.1.2012 00:28 half wrote:
Necklace of the Dwarves at 150 ft isn't bad. I'm a bit puzzled why it took so long to identify it though. Did you not try it on?

Yes, charge is very good. We're not sure it is balanced, but it is very fun, so we certainly want it to be good enough to see frequent play. It does tempt you to do silly things at times though, and is no use when you are surrounded. Do try combining it with some of: Flanking, Knock Back, Stun. I'd also be tempted to increase melee a bit more so you can use the Great Axe and go for 8d9 damage charges. That will trigger Knock Back and Stun every time, but unfortunately will probably just kill the enemy too...

On 27.1.2012 00:43 Scatha wrote:
Interestingly the superior War Hammer, when 2-handed, is just as good as the Great Axe but with an extra 2 to hit. On the other hand it weighs a lot less. If you had Stun and Knock Back I don't know whether the reduced weight would be reason enough to use the axe; even without charging 4d9 would get you to the threshold most of the time.

Have fun destroying the dark hordes!

On 27.1.2012 01:53 HallucinationMushroom wrote:
My only goal for this guy is to attempt to knock off Morgoth's crown with his head still on it. I'm not in this one to win it, in other words.

I have no idea of his regeneration rate or really actually much of anything. But, if I could charge with a mattock, which maybe charges around 12d12 depending on potions, rings, what-nots... I'd like to think I could take some stars of health off. I crafted a really heavy one for just his purpose. Fight maybe on some random level after I nab a silmaril with a lot of space and not many enemies? If what I read on his description isn't lying, and my memory isn't faulty, which it always is, he has 500 hp and 5d4 protection. Charge run charge charge run? If knockback works, that would be even better. It would be like a knight jousting in nethack, which is pretty sweet. The accuracy would be pretty bad, but from experience I was hitting old Morgy at a decent rate with a mattock once upon a time... not great, but decent.

Should I live so long, my plan is to max melee, grab knockback and str, get swap position, buy out archery tree for dex point (instead of sharpness which wouldn't apply) consider getting con point on will tree, consider getting more evasion for the dex point, consider getting dex point from stealth.

On 27.1.2012 04:37 HallucinationMushroom wrote:
Alright. I've learned by looking at one of Hugo's characters that 20 doesn't appear to be an upper bound for the skills, so maybe I'll rethink my archery and stealth ideas for the dex points, since my main idea was to grab those for accuracy. It'd be cheaper to just pump melee some more. I have found this really cool axe that I'm currently getting 4d13 damage with. It's kind of heavy, and also has vampirism! I took out a unique 'f' in one charge with it! The yellow one that shoots the arrows. Maybe I should nab whirlwind and just surround myself with a bunch of meatsacks for the Morgy fight. I usually have more protection at this point, and have sacrificed some here and some there. On the other hand, my evasion is pretty high for not having put points into it for a long while. My mattock is currently sitting on 6d10 damage, but I suspect since it's so heavy that 6d13 is possible... my axe is maxed out at 4d13. I've been sitting on these levels as long as possible to try and get the most experience and loot that I can. It's kind of a gamble though, since a lot of these late fights cost me my potions and herbs that I really need to stockpile if I want a serious chance at damaging Morgoth.

On 27.1.2012 04:43 HallucinationMushroom wrote:
Oh yeah, I forgot to answer your question about the necklace of the dwarves. Yeah, I didn't put it on until I nabbed lore-master. I don't often wear the unid stuff because I'm a pessimist and just assume it will be cursed and if it isn't cursed, it will be of hunger or danger or something like that.

On 27.1.2012 04:54 sethos wrote:
Just a thought - I've never been that far - but what of the silmaril's curse that I heard about? if the throne rooms not too bad and you only want to try and KO morgy, you may be better off fighting him there, before you grab a silmaril.

if you beat him, you could grab all three and walk out at your leisure, I'd think.

On 27.1.2012 09:02 Psi wrote:
Does heavier than usual armour have any benefit aside from the Heavy Armour Use ability?

And once again - a storming run!

On 27.1.2012 11:25 half wrote:
Good luck with your (insane) plan! Since so much of your game centers around hitting Morgoth with a mattock, it might be worth forging a 6d3 one. I'm not sure. Given how Knock Back works, it may be that it is more important to get your accuracy up to ensure you connect as many times as possible. You can do some really interesting tactics with Knock Back, especially if you have things like Flanking and Sprinting and Charge. Sprinting might be irrelevant for the final fight though as you will drink a potion.

In Sil, normal monsters and the player will regenerate 1/150th of their health each turn. If the player has a regeneration item, this is doubled, and if a monster regenerates (like Trolls, Nameless Things, Unrelenting Horrors, Morgoth), then it is multiplied by 5. So he will regenerate 1/50th of his health per turn = 10 health for each of his turns. This will be pretty hard to deal with!

On 27.1.2012 11:46 Psi wrote:
One of those figures must be a typo. Is it 1/250 per turn, regeneration multiplies by 3 or does Morgoth regenerate 1/30th of his health per turn?

On 27.1.2012 12:03 half wrote:
It turns out that multiplying by 5 is beyond me! It is 1/30th of his health per turn = 16.7 health per turn.

I would have liked the player and monster regeneration traits to give the same multiplier, but it turns out that since you kill monsters so quickly, they need a much higher multiplier to be properly noticeable in play. Giving the player that much would be *very* strong.

On 27.1.2012 14:42 HallucinationMushroom wrote:
Wow, I was hoping his regeneration rate was much lower, like 5 per round. That is a pretty steep hill. Before I started this farce, I was imagining a sort of hit and run scenario, where I charge, run away charge again, etc... But, he would regen too fast for that I see. I'm going to have to go toe-to-toe and hope Morgoth doesn't resist knockbacks and that I get lucky with repeated successful charge attempts. Yeah, I'm doomed.

As far as the throne room idea, that would be big and bold indeed! Just run in going, RAHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!! and just start whapping away. It is damned tempting, I must admit. I guess I could try hiding in a corner, but that didn't work so well with one of my powerful warriors. The throne room seems to draw late game uniques, and rightfully so. But, I have not heard of this Silmaril curse thing.

As far as I can tell Psi, heavier armor only matters if you have heavy armor mastery. It could be just coincidence, but I have noticed that oddities in weapon +tohit and +todamage and armor evasion and protection bonuses often have an appropriate weight correlation. For example, most of the -1 3d5 Greatswords I find are lighter, and the 2d6 long corslets are heavier. Again, maybe just luck.

On 27.1.2012 16:31 HallucinationMushroom wrote:
Stockpiling lots of nice potions and buffing melee as much as possible. How useful is stun, exactly? I'm assuming it means a lower +to hit bonus, but does it grant other really tasty things? I know Morgoth can be stunned since I've done it before.

On 27.1.2012 17:07 HallucinationMushroom wrote:
Are you kidding me?! ARE YOU KIDDING ME?!!!
I just found a unique mattock that shaves off a bunch of the to hit penalty and still weighs 11 pounds. I haven't tried out a strength potion with it, but I do that it will at least go to 6d12. Wow. Also, I've got a nice stockpile of experience but I'm running out of time. I wish I had defiance... I keep getting afraid. Also, an ancient serpent of something breathed some truly nasty darkness damage on me. I could use a brighter light radius... Mayhaps I should've nabbed a regular old +2 cloak. Wow. This is getting exciting!

On 27.1.2012 17:14 Scatha wrote:
You weren't tempted to take on the Gloomweaver? ;)

I believe a stunned creature gets a -2 penalty to all of its skill rolls (for you the relevant ones will be Melee and Evasion).

Anyhow, nice find in that Mattock!

On 27.1.2012 18:05 half wrote:
Yes, that is right about stunning.

In the future I plan to at least allow for heavy stunning (-4) and maybe knocking out, like for the player.

Yes, good work with the unique Mattock!

On 27.1.2012 18:46 HallucinationMushroom wrote:
I really did want to tackle Drauglin and Ungoliant and Shelob, but I couldn't get to them! I couldn't make a secret door appear, no rock eaters or monsters opened up any door and I couldn't break any of the granite break where there should've been a door. After wasting a decent amount of time trying to get to them, I decided to cut my losses and just move on. I really sincerely wanted to get into that web!

On 27.1.2012 20:30 HallucinationMushroom wrote:
Dang, ran out of time to repeat 950' only just a few feet away from the stairs! But, I can't really get down on myself, I have quite a stash! I'm standing by the staircase down and contemplating burning some turns to get myself hungry. I've turned off mind-over-body and I could always equip my vampiric axe and walk back and get maeglin's armor to speed the process up. I had to remove my shadow cloak against a few monsters to combat their sheer darkness. I suppose that my darkness problem will be solved once I pry a silmaril and wear it. I was able to get a silmaril no problem with my regular mattock with Milkmaid, so hopefully that will work again. It'd be nice to have Angrist. It's still tempting to do the fight in the throne room, too. I'll probably mull over the very end for at least six hours. This is probably the luckiest I'll ever get with drops for a charge-to-kill-Morgoth attempt, so I better get it right this time if I'm ever going to succeed.

Oh yeah, and a one-hit kill for Shelob, a whomping 12d10 charge. I should turn back on the dice rolls window.

On 28.1.2012 00:55 HallucinationMushroom wrote:
Wow, that was kind of fun and a bit silly too. I decided to go ahead and fight Morgy in his throne room, but in one of the smallish antechambers. I figured, why not, if I'm going to be delusional enough to think I can kill Morgoth I might as well go whole hog. I was able to dish out enough damage when charging to take a star of health off, but I couldn't deliver another charge fast enough before it would regenerate. Morgoth causes rubble and pits that make consistent charging pretty much impossible to boot. My regular attack did some damage, and he was stunned for the entire fight, but not enough to go toe-to-toe without charging to kill him. After several attack rounds my healing stores were at 66%. At that point I realized it was futile and tried some different charging tactics. Still, no luck. At 33% healing stores everybody else had long ago bugged out and it was just me and Morgoth. It got quite farcical at one point where he would walk up to me and I would just knock him back over and over again. I decided to try to get more Silmarils so I would hit Morgoth who would land out of sight behind a wall, I would use my turn to try and grab another silmaril, fail, and Morgoth would return. We did this silly dance for maybe 30 attack rounds. I was hitting him 9 out of 10 times so accuracy sure wasn't the problem. How do you get more silmarils? The game kept telling me to maybe change weapons so I tried them all about 5 times each. Anyway, I still had enough potions to probably make it out to the surface but I decided to just screw around a little longer with Morgoth's crown and try some more charging before I eventually died. I probably knocked off that first star a dozen times but I never saw the second come off. I haven't looked at my notes yet but I think I killed Thuringwethil and maybe Lungorthin as Morgoth and I were fighting. Oh well, that is the very best I can do at Sil. I'll have to be content with my 2 winners. I did make a backup save before the fight in case I killed him and the game crashed, haha, so maybe I'll reload it a few times and try the fight out a few more times to see if I can come up with any bright ideas. In any case, this guy was a lot of fun.

On 28.1.2012 01:02 HallucinationMushroom wrote:
Cool, I went about 343 turns with Morgoth. If I had wanted to, I think I could've fought him till I starved to death.

On 28.1.2012 01:24 Scatha wrote:
Well, that sounds like it was fun!

The Silmarils get consecutively harder to cut out, so some form of sharpness helps a lot.

How much experience do you have in that save? I have a suspicion of a method which might let you take him down, but I don't want to say too much.

On 28.1.2012 01:35 HallucinationMushroom wrote:
I think about 1700, but I quickly get about 6500 at one point. I just had a very good attempt. I had a lot of space and I was able to get many repeated charges on him and got him down to 3 or 4 stars. If I hadn't of gotten surrounded by a lot of other things I think I could've killed him at that point, I was really in a groove. So, maybe I'll try to fight him on a normal level in my next tries, but tomorrow. In any case, I think I'll get him with my save character eventually. If I can manage it, I might try again. And, just for the record, sitting in the middle of Morgoth's throne room in a rage craze with a bad ass vampiric great exe? Priceless. I mowed through everything.

On 28.1.2012 03:31 sethos wrote:
"Sorry Morgoth, But I don't really care for your decoration -I've brought in my own interior decorator (Brandishes Axe), meaning I'll mostly be decorating with your interiors."

For the record - That's order of the stick - but I couldn't stop thinking it when I read that last message. Awesome.

On 28.1.2012 13:06 half wrote:
Great work. I hope hoping you'd succeed! Next time you get up to Morgoth, try eating your namesake -- it will make the battle more fun.

Sorry about the lack of feedback with the Silmarils -- I was assuming you would have the combat-rolls window open. Try again with it open to see what is happening. It will help you understand this process *much* better. Nice work with Morgoth. I also think there are some tactics that should let you beat Morgoth with this build (either my way or, more likely, Scatha's -- we've compared notes!).

I'll note that you have Morgoth in an interesting position there: if you knock him back, he goes out of LOS. This could be a useful trick to learn (e.g. for a great fire drake), though it requires a particular set up: lucky you have a weapon for digging through granite!

On 28.1.2012 15:40 HallucinationMushroom wrote:
I like the order of the stick too. I got their bumper sticker for x-mas from the fam... you know, the one that spoofs the 'this-is-my-family-in-stick-figure'. I also got the Elan, I'm participating, sweater, since I'm pretty much Elan in real life. At least, the whole naive good thing and maybe not so much the charismatic bard thing, anyway.

Well, I wouldn't mind private messages that offer suggestions on how I could tweak this to kill Morgoth, if you don't want that kind of knowledge floating around. If I were to make another warrior I'd probably buy more of the special abilities instead of pumping melee so high... even with a regular mattock I would hit a decent amount of the time. Also, since I have no interest in stealth or song, and only a mild interest in smithing, I'm pretty much going to be making the same character over and over again. Variety is wasted on me.

On 29.1.2012 01:05 HallucinationMushroom wrote:
Alright, I got him. I shouldn't have been so impatient to fight him. I just grabbed a quick silmaril by the 'cat stair' and went up and explored 950 a couple of times until he showed up... in that time I just ran around killing everything nabbing more potions. When we fought this time around I knew what to expect and just charged and charged and charged without having to worry too much about monsters in the area. He still made the area nasty with pits and rubble and I had him down to 1 star but he ended up regenerating about 3 before I could work him back into a killable position. Dammit! It's kind of frustrating knowing I could've killed him with my current character... but knowledge equals real experience in Sil, no doubt. Maybe I'll try again... and perhaps I should hurry before Sil gets patched up to make him tougher anyway!

On 29.1.2012 15:28 half wrote:
Yes, do try (you have now seen what you get to do if you succeed without save-scumming!). Perhaps try with a high critical chance character if you want a break from heavy weapons chargers.

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